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Home My WebLink AboutPB-07/25/1988 l� Town Hall, 53095 Main Road P.O. Box 1179 Southold. New York 11971 TELEPHONE (516)765-1938 PLANNING BOARD OFFICE TOWN OF SOUTHOLD PLANNING BOARD MINUTES JULY 25, 1988 The Southold Town Planning Board held a regular meeting on Monday, July 25, 1988 at 7:30 p.m. at the , Southold Town Hall, Main Road, Southold. PRESENT WERE: Bennett Orlowski,Jr. Chairman Member William F. Mullen, Jr. Member G: Ritchie Latham, Jr. Member Richard G. Ward Member Kenneth L. Edwards Town Planner Valerie Scopaz Assistant Planner Melissa Spiro`-- Secretary Jill Thorp Mr. Orlowski: Good Evening. I would like to call this meeting to order. The first order of business is 7 : 30 p.m. East Marion Woods- Public hearing on the question .of final approval for this major subdivision. This parcel is on 59. 827 acres located at East Marion. SCTM #1000-30-1-5.1. We have proof of publication in the Suffolk Times and also proof of publication in the Long Island Traveler/Watchman. At this time everything is in order for a final hearing. I will .ask if there are any objections to this major subdivision? Hearing none, are there any endorsements of this subdivision? Mr. Price: For the record, I am Irving L. Price,Jr. I am an Attorney of Law. With law offices of 828 Front Street in Greenport, New York. I represent the applicant, Staller, in this application for a major subdivision. This has commenced in 1982. We felt we had preliminary approval at one time when it was one acre lots. We fell under the revision when two acre lots came in. We have had a hearing before the Town Board as to whether or not we had qualified. The Town B rd had decided we had not. The case went to the appellate division. It was sent back for a rehearing. We had the rehearing and again the Town Board found that we were not qualified for the two acre lots and suggested that a compromise be made between the Town Board and the Planning' Board Page 2 July 25 , 1988 applicant. We have been doing that, I believe, for almost two years. We feel we have complied with all of the requirements and requests from the various Board' s. I move its approval. Thank you. Mr. Orlowski.: O.K. Are there any other endorsements of this subdivision? Hearing none, is. anyone out there that is neither pro nor con, but may have information pertaining to this subdivision that would be of interest to the Board? Hearing none, any questions from the Board? Mr. Mullen, Mr. Latham, Mr. Ward, Mr. Edwards? Comments from the Board: None. Mr. Orlowski: Ms. Scopaz? Ms. Scopaz: No. Mr. Orlowski: Being no further questions, I will declare this hearing closed and thank you for coming. Mr. Orlowski: Moving onto Nicholas Aliano- Board to make a determination on the final maps of this major subdivision subject to receipt of fee in-lieu-of. land for park and playground. This parcel is on 16.83 acres located at Peconic. SCTM #1000-74-4-4. What is the pleasure of the Board? I think the Board would like to see some street trees; along. 4.8. I don' t know if the applicant will have any problem with that. Mr. Raynor can you comment? Mr. Raynor: Mr. Chairman, as agent to the applicant we will take into consideration anything that the Board suggest at this time. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. What is the Board pleasure? Mr. Mullen: I move approval subject to the street trees. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Next we have Henry Lytle- Board to authorize the Chairman to sign the final maps for this minor subdivision. This parcel is on 9. 06 acres located at Peconic. SCTM #1000-68-1-13 . As of yet we have not received the filing of the C & R s so a motion would not be in order to sign these. Unless the Board Planning Board Page 3 July 25 , 1988 will like to make a motion subject to receiving those filed covenants. Mr. Mullen: I prefer we get the .covenants, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. We will put that on hold. Mr. Orlowski: Next we have RHR Realty- Board to make a determination on the final maps of this minor subdivision subject to receipt of a bond estimate for a 20' road and a 75' conservation easement from the wetlands. This parcel is on 12. 6351 acres located at Southold. SCTM #1000-59-3-16.1. What is the pleasure of the Board? Any motion should be subject to those conditions. Mr. Ward: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in. favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham., Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Thomas Shalvey- Board to take action on the sketch map for this minor subdivision. We are going to do things a little bit different, we are going to start the coordination process to determine lead agency and environmental significance. We will be -sending this out asking everybody if they are happy with us being lead agent and then receive any comments from. there. We will proceed this way. Mr. Mullen: It saves time. Mr. Orlowski: We will start that coordination process with a motion? Mr. Edwards: So moved. Mr. Mullen: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So order. At this time everything is in order for sketch. What is the pleasure of the Board? Mr. Latham: Move it. Planning Board Page 4 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Mullen: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Ward: Mr. Chairman, I think we think we should address the applicant with a comment that the building envelopes be addressed on each lot so they favor the North Road rather then the Rail Road. Just as a comment. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. We will address that to the applicant. Mr. Orlowski: Bertram Holder- Board to take action on the sketch map for this minor subdivision. Board to start the coordination process to determine lead agency and environmental significance. At this time I will entertain a. motion for starting the coordination. Mr. Edwards: So moved. Mr. Mullen: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. At this time everything is in .order for sketch. Mr. Ward: This is shown as a set off . Mr. Orlowski: Yes, but it is going to be handled as a minor. Mr. Ward: O.K. Mr. Edwards: Move for approval. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Planning Board Page 5 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Orlowski: O.K. 7 : 45 p.m. Next order of business is DBM-Cluster proposal- Public hearing on the question of preliminary approval for this major subdivision. This parcel is on 37.762 acres located at Southold. SCTM 41000-55-6-15.1. We have proof of publication in the Suffolk Times and also in the Long Island Traveler/Watchman. At this time everything is in order for a preliminary hearing. I will ask if there are any objections to this cluster subdivision? Mr. Kreiling: My name is Paul Kreiling. I live on 630 Yennecott Drive. On the cluster proposal, on the area of open space. I am not very familiar on the clustering zoning. Does cluster mean in this open space that is in this diagram, is that to be forever barren? Mr. Orlowski: Forever. Mr. Kreiling: O.K. Thank you. Mr. Orlowski: Any other objections to this subdivision? Hearing no objections, are there any endorsements of this subdivision? Mr. Moore: On behalf of my client I, of course, endorse it, but I don' t have any questions or comments to make at this time. Mr. Orlowski: Any other endorsements to this subdivision? Mr. Tuthill: Donald Tuthill, Southold. I really...don' t have any objections,_ I have just a couple questions. In the open space, there are taxes on that and who pays the taxes on that forever? Mr. Orlowski: They will form an association in here and they will all be responsible for the taxes. All the taxes will be based on a two acre parcel or two acre density. The taxes will be paid by the homeowners in there. Mr. Tuthill: The only other thing I bring up is the fact that approximately two thirds of the road drain into the recharge basin. Approximately one third will drain. into Yennecott, which is below the recharge basin on Yennecott Drive. It will eventually go into Long Creek Drive and not be recharged. My only thought is if it did come in from Boisseau Ave. The elevation there is twenty, seven feet . . . almost continues all the way to the recharge basin and you will- have almost 100% drainage into the recharge basin instead of about 30% of the more going into Yennecott Drive which is going to drain down to the Creek and not be recharged into the ground. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. We will take that comment into consideration for our engineer to review. Are there any other objections to this subdivision? Hearing none, is there any one out there that is neither pro nor con but may have information pertaining to this subdivision that would be of. interest to .the Board? Hearing Planning Board Page 6 July 25 , 1988 none, any questions from the Board? Mr. Mullen, Mr. Latham, Mr. Ward, Mr. Edwards? Reply of the Board: None. Mr. Orlowski: Ms. Scopaz? Ms. Scopaz: The only recommendation that I would make is with regard to the drainage. That we ask the applicant to modify the drainage proposal to prevent any runoff onto the adjacent subdivision. And also to eliminate the need to have a fenced recharge basin to use more natural drainage swales. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. We will address those comments to the applicant. Being no further questions, I will declare this hearing closed and thank you for coming down. Mr. Orlowski: Howard Rosenstone- Board to take action on the sketch map for this major subdivision. Board to start the coordination process to determine lead agency and environmental significance. I will entertain that motion. Mr. Latham: So moved. Mr. Mullen: Seconded. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any ;questions . on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. What is the pleasure of the Board in regard to sketch? Mr. Latham: I move we grant sketch. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham., Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. - Mr. Orlowski: Too Bee Realty- Board to take action on the sketch map for this minor subdivision. This parcel is on 7.956 acres located at Southold. SCTM #1000-50-6-5. Mr. Ward: Move for approval. Mr. Latham: Second. Planning Board Page 7 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Orlowski: The motion should include subject to receiving the Road Profiles, so we make sure we get them. Mr. Ward: O.K. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Calvin Rasweiler- Board to make a determination on this major subdivision under the State Environmental Quality Review Act. This parcel is on 55. 9 acres located at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-129-1-1. At this time everything is in order for a negative declaration.. Mr. Mullen: So moved. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Farmveu Associates- Board to make a determination on this major subdivision under the State Environmental. Quality Review Act. This parcel is on 111. 672 acres located at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-11.3-7-19.2. Mr. Mullen: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered.. Mr. Orlowski: Mohring Enterprises, Inc. - Board to start coordination process to determine lead agency and environmental significance. This parcel is on 36.9636 acres located at Mattituck. - SCTM #1000-113-7-19.2. Mr. Edwards: So moved. Planning Board Page 8 . July 25 , 1988 Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and. seconded. Any questions on the. motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Also we will request the the applicant change the name on the subdivision to be a bit more enticing then Mohring Enterprises. Mr. Orlowski: Rita Brown- Board to make a determination on this minor subdivision under the State Environmental Quality Review Act. This parcel is on 12. 506 acres located at Mattituck.. SCTM #1000-94-3-1.3 . Everything is in order for a negative dec. Mr. Latham: I ' ll move it. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Greenfield Estates- Board to make a determination on this major subdivision under the State Environmental Quality Review Act.' This parcel is on 46.5712 acres located at Southold. SCTM #1000-95-4-4.1. Everything is in order for a negative ,dec. Mr. Mullen: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: East Wind Corporation- Board to review this site plan. This parcel is on 21,430 sq.ft. located at New Suffolk. SCTM #1000-117-8-6. Mr. Ward, I think you had some comments on the review. Mr. Ward: Is Mr. Strang here? There he is. Planning Board Page .9 July 25, 1988 Mr. McLaughlin: My name is Kevin McLaughlin. I am here also representing this application. Mr. Ward: O.K. Just in looking at it. Maybe you, could just look at a couple of these. It seems to be an excessive pitch across here in the paved area. You are looking at a two foot drop 20, 40 or 50 feet. Down in here. Is there any way that this could be dropped? Mr. Strang: I. don' t see why not. I think we can work with it. Mr. Ward: I don't think we have any problems subject to these comments. Everything else looks in pretty good shape. We had just a question if we have these steps, we need railings for some of the site steps. Just put a note on the plan that you will have railings. You are going to have to have them any way. Other then that just back against here, where you are against the neighbors. If we saw-tooth this you might be able to sneak a couple of trees in or something with the curb line in there. If you used your bumper stops or ran the curb line in a saw-tooth fashion we might get a little landscaping between that house. You wouldn't loose any parking. You might get a few trees in. Plant the trees close to the fence or something. That is really about it. It looks pretty good. If you want you can take this copy. Mr. Strang: O.K. That will be helpful. Mr. Orlowski: Do you have an floor plan for the building itself? For storage and sale area or office area. Mr. Ward: We wanted to keep something in the file that would show your parking program related to square footage of the building. Mr. Strang: I think there is site data that dictates what is allocated for retail and storage in respect to parking. Mr. McLaughlin: We have supplied. you with the square footage of the second floor apartment that you have requested as well. Mr. Strang: I don' t think he is locked into a definitive floor plan because he has no idea what the situation is going to be tenant wise, what the tenant needs are going to be. I think he is trying to leave it as flexible as possible. Mr. Ward: Our concern is one of approving the parking and maybe it won' t match up with what the building ultimately would be. It might be better to amend it later. Fix something in that shows what you are approximately planning to do, which reflects what. you are doing in the site plan, and if you have to change it at. least there is a basis for changing it. Planning Board Page 10 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Strang: O.K. I just assumed that given the fact that it was submitted it could lock itself into and he could address it by saying he only has so many square feet of retail and when it hits the Building Department for alteration plans they can say oops your over or you are O.K. Mr. Ward: O.K. It may be possible to fly that way on that. Mr. Strang: I think he would rather if he could. At this point, till he knows where his tenants are. Mr. Ward: Do we have a problem with that at all? Mr. Orlowski: The only thing is the longer the floor plan, it has to match up with the site plan as far as parking. We would like to have something in our record to show that it is consistent. Mr. Ward: Maybe at the time you do file with them (Building Dept. ) you can file a copy with us. Then we can have it in the file. Mr. Strang: That will be the easiest way to do that. Mr. Orlowski: Do you want to approve that subject to those comments? Mr. Ward: Yes. So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Walsh Park- Board to make a determination on the site plan under the State Environmental Quality Review Act. This parcel is located at Fishers Island. SCTM #1000-6-2-3 .1. We have a letter from the Office of Ecology from the County, requesting that we wait a short period of time so they can finish up on their comments. We will hold that one. Next we have Andrew Stype- Board to discuss sending this site plan to the Building Department for certification. This parcel is located on the Main Road at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-122-7-6.6. Mr. Mullen: So moved. Mr. Ward: Second. Planning Board Page 11 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham., Ward., Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Marina Bay Club-Board to discuss correspondence from the Department of Environmental Conservation. This parcel is located on 3. 45 acres at new Suffolk. SCTM #1000-117-8-18. I think that we should just ask the applicant to address these comments in his supplement. I will entertain a motion to send this over to the applicant with- that request. Mr. Mullen: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Next we have an 8:00 p.m. The .Woods at. Cutchogue- Public hearing on the question. of preliminary approval for this -major -subdivision. This parcel is on 29. 540 acres located at Cutchogue. SCTM #1000-102-1-4. We have proof of publication in the Suffolk Times and also in the Long Island Traveler/ Watchman. At this time everything is in order for a preliminary hearing and I will ask if there are .any objections to this major subdivision? Hearing none, are there any endorsements to this subdivision? Hearing none, is there anyone out there that is neither pro nor con but have may information pertaining to this subdivision that would be of interest to the Board? Hearing none, are there any questions from the the Board? Mr. Mullen, Mr. Latham, Mr. Ward, Mr. Edwards? . Comments of the Board: None. Mr. Orlowski: Ms. Scopaz? Ms. Scopaz: No. Mr. Orlowski: Being no further questions I will declare this hearing closed and thank you for coming. Applicant: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Mr. Orlowski: I knew somebody was here. Planning Board Page 12 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Orlowski: Church of Transfiguration of Christ- Board to review this site plan. This parcel is on Breakwater Road at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-106-9-6.1. This plan has been certified by the Building Department. The only comments and recommendations we have are that the drainage remain on site and a few street trees and screening of evergreens. They had no problem with that. We can approve it subject to. Mr. Ward: So moved. Mr. Edwards: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Founders Village- Board to discuss request for certificate of occupancy. This site plan is located on Young' s Avenue at Southold. SCTM #1000-63-1-28. Recommending a C.O. for building number eight. Mr. Mullen: Everything was in order other then the parking bumpers and also the final coat for the black top. Otherwise it was in good condition, plenty of greenery around- it too. I recommend approval. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Feather Hill- Board to discuss request for certificate of occupancy. This site plan is located on the Main Road at Southold. SCTM #1000-61-1,11,12,13 . Mr. Mullen: Mr. Chairman, I must refrain from participating in this situation.. Mr. Ward: I move for approval. I inspected it today and the site is in good shape. Mr. Edwards: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? A11 those in favor? Planning Board Page 13 July 25 , 1988 Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Oliver Campbell- Board to review this site plan. SCTM #1000-84-3-5. We have reviewed it and everything is in order for an uncoordinated review and negative dec. I will entertain that motion.. Mr. Latham: I' ll move it. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered.. Everything is in order to send this over for certification subject to receipt of revised maps showing the ZBA conditions, a 251 easement, shifting the driveway out of the 25' easement and on asphalt driveway. These conditions should be put on the map. We should send it over subject to that. Mr. Edwards: So moved. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Young' s Marina- Board to make a determination on this site plan under the State Environmental Quality Review Act. This parcel is located on Sage Blvd. at Greenport. SCTM #1000-57-1-38.3 . Everything is in order for a negative dec. Mr. Ward: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Planning- Board, Page 14 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Orlowski: Wolf Pit Pond Estates- Board to refer this major subdivision to the Town Board for a determination on the amount of money to be deposited with the Town in lieu of land for park and playground. This parcel is on 65. 3810 acres located at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-107-4-2.1. Mr. Edwards: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Henry Arbeeny- Board to accept and request compliance with the Suffolk County Planning Commission review, dated July 8, 1988, for this major subdivision. This parcel is on 7 . 592 acres located at Southold. SCTM #1000-59-7-31. Mr. Ward: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any question on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. The Suffolk County Planning request that all C & R s be submitted and reviewed and put on the maps and filed with the County Clerk. We will request that. Mr. Orlowski: Walter Grabie- Board to accept and request' compliance with the Suffolk County Planning Commission review, dated July 8, . 1988, for this lot line change. This parcel is located on the Main Road. at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-114-11-7 .129. Mr. Edwards: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Planning Board Page 15 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Orlowski: George Waterman- Board to accept and request compliance with the Suffolk County Planning Commission review, dated July 8, 1988, for this lot line change. Board to make a determination under the State Environmental Quality Review Act. This parcel is on 4. 38 acres located at Fishers Island. SCTM #1000-3-1-2,3 . At this time everything is order for a negative dec. I will entertain that motion. Mr. Edwards: So moved. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. What is the pleasure on the Planning Commission comments? Mr. Mullen: Accept and request compliance. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered.. Mr. Orlowski: Anthony and Sally Pirrera- Board to accept and request compliance with the Suffolk County Planning - Commission review, dated July 8, 1988, for this minor subdivision. This parcel is on 5. 208 acres located at Greenport. SCTM #100-40-1-20. Mr. Latham: Move it. Mr. Mullen: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Joseph L. Townsend Jr. & Plum Gut Properties, LTD- Board to make a determination on the Suffolk County Planning Commission review, dated July 8, 1988, on this minor subdivision. This parcel is on 15. 679 acres located at Orient. Planning Board Page 16 July 25 , 1988 SCTM #1000-18-3-9.1 Suffolk County requested that it be disapproved. Their reasons are a standard set of reasons that it . is a creation_ of a land locked parcel, which we know that it is not the case. I recommend that we override this. Mr. Latham: Move it. Mr. Edwards: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Mr. Ward: Are you doing all of them? Mr. Orlowski: Yes. The second condition. goes along with the first. Mr. Ward: I thought there was some other item regarding set backs and things. ( looked at report) O.K. Mr. Orlowski: They are all standard, so we can override them all.. Ms. -Scopaz: You might want to mention to the County that you have two adjacent subdivisions and that you allow for a 'fifty foot right-of-way for more than half the property involved. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski.: Sunbeau Associates- Board to accept the bond estimate and letter of' credit for $169,155.00 Board to recommend acceptance of the $169,155.00 letter of credit to the Town Board. This parcel is on 30.637 acres located at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-100-2-5.1. Mr. Edwards: Moved. Mr. Mullen: Mr. Chairman, I am slightly confused. Which is not unusual. I have a letter here that was issued June 2, 1988 by the North Fork Bank giving us a letter of credit for $50,000. from August 1, 1988 to July 31, 1989. Here we are looking for bond or a letter of credit for a $169,000. Mr. Raynor: Mr. Chairman, if I might shed a .little .lite on the situation. That was put foreword voluntarily on behalf of the applicant in order to expedite the subdivision. Not knowing at the time the latest that Sidney Bowne' s has created. Mr. Mullen: So the applicant knows that the. . . Planning Board Page 17 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Raynor: The applicant has already revised the bond estimate to the specification of Sidney Bowne. I think it is in the file. I would ask the Board if they would approve this because the applicant is desirous of a closing on one of the properties. Thank you for you considerations. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. I think our recommendation is to approve the 169 and make recommendation to the Town Board. Mr. Mullen: So moved. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Franklin Born- Board to accept the bond estimate for $21,000. 00 on this minor subdivision. Board to recommend acceptance of the $21, 000.00 bond estimate to the Town Board. This parcel is on 6. 369 acres at Southold. SCTM #1000-55-2-25. Mr. Latham: I move to accept it and recommend it to the Town Board. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; ' Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Charles. Acres- Board to grant a six ( 6) month extension for the filing of the final maps of this major subdivision, from August 9, 1988 .to February 9, 1989. This parcel is on 32. 8 acres - located at Peconic. SCTM #1000-86-1-10.3 . Mr. Mullen: So moved. Mr. Latham: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion .made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Planning Board Page 18 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Mr. Orlowski: Next we have Manor Hill Estates- Board to discuss this application for a major subdivision with the applicant. This parcel is on 115.6580 acres located at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-101-1-4.1,4.3,4.4,4.5. I think the Board will like to see it clustered more to the north where you have the open space now and try to keep the open space more up in the middle here. Mr. Saland: I don' t know what to say. These were the changes that you recommended to Mr. Carr. We met over last year on this piece. Again there is more blocks. . . He was anticipating going up for preliminary approval on this map given the changes that you requested.. I will go back to him, I know he is going to be shocked. Mr. Orlowski: Know you are taking a parcel as a hole where before we were only looking at half. Mr. Saland: Valerie requested from us that we show an anticipated subdivision for this. , There are no plans for this. Again we thought we were complying with what Valerie asked. All we are doing is Section one, we don' t have any plans to do section two at all. We were just doing the Planning Board a favor on their request. I don't see why we are penalized for that. You are penalizing him on something that.;he is not even before you on. Mr. Orlowski: I don't think it is a penalty. You are showing us what you are going to do and we are showing you what we think should be done with the whole parcel. Mr. Saland: This was just our submission to the. Board for overall review. We are not applying for this now. Nor do I think Mr. Carr will. It is just one plan that Howie had on this piece. Valerie asked what if you would. subdivide the entire piece and, this is our reaction to it. This is a maybe. By no means is this a plan. It could just as well be blank. I have no plans for it nor does he. To change this map around again for something that might never happen seems a little absurd to me. Ms. Scopaz: Mr. Chairman, My I ask the applicant a question? Is the property on the market for sale as one piece? Mr. Saland: Yes it is. Ms. Scopaz: The proposed revisions encompasse a different land area from the first application that was made to the Board, is that right? Mr. Young: Section one? Planning Board Page 19 July 25 , 1988 Ms. Scopaz: Yes. Mr. Young: Yes. It , is different. We can make it the same if that is a problem. The Planning Board approved the sketch section one and we went back and Valerie reviewed it and came up with some criticism which was the extension of this road. What if somebody subdivided this further? How would the road connect? So we brought back this and showed how this road, that we propose to do now, might connect with some logical way to do it. Doing that I changed the open' space around a little bit and reconfigured something here to get the correct amount of open space for the twenty four lots that we desired to develope here. This plan and the preliminary plan which are very similar accept we moved this road down, in through here. With other criticism about the high tension line and spread away from that. Basically we wanted to subdivided section one along Elijah' s Lane which we have done on both plans. I thought when we left that this was only to show a possibility and an over all plan which is a good. idea. We have no intentions of filing section two at this time. Again, I certainly agree with the concept that this is a good idea to see the whole thing. Our plan or the clients plan has not changed since we have started, on what he-would like to develope. He did at one time look into the possibility of conveying the developments on this to the Town of Southold. He has no intention of developing the lots. Ms. Scopaz: And yet you said the entire property is up for sale? Mr. Young: Everything is always for sale, right? For the right .number. I understand that any subdivision approval goes with the land. It does not go to Mr. Carr or Mr. Saland. I thought we were complying with what you desire to make an orderly development and correct the location of the street from the objections of the street being here and we moved it here. That is basic. Our ideas have not changed. So to take these lots or any of these lots and put them up'here now in what we considered open space. Which would be attractive to these people and has the grapes on them. Mr. Saland: In fact, I can speak for Mr. Carr. No wonder half these negotiating. . . Alex Hargrave is leasing and possibly working with the vineyard at this time. The majority will probably stay in vineyards forever. That is what is going on now. There is no talk about selling that. Mr. Ward: Except you are wiping out vineyards below. Mr. Young: We are. Mr. Ward: In our opinion, the open space beyond. these homes is nothing but in fact the overall community. To move some of these houses up front and put them back in there. That was our impression. What we are doing is reacting to your future plan in Planning Board Page 20 July 25 , 1988 a sense by seeing it and saying that it is not the way we would approve it. Mr. Saland: It is not a future plan. Again it was just 'a road profile. Mr. Ward: I understand that it is a layout but than again this is the reason we ask for it, because one you see where the density will go. We are not really happy with the layout. We don' t see where there will be any more road involved in the future. Mr. Young: I was wondering if you can give me a little bit more leeway on my end if you give me. . . I understand what you are saying. You want some density here and more up here. If you. give me the opportunity to draw. Mr. Ward: Yes. Mr. Young: If you let me know what your criticism are. We are not looking for more than twenty four lots at this time. I am not sure, this is where we get into a difference of opinion in planning whether you are doing these people a service by crowding everybody in here or. . . I understand the importances of openness and various other concerns, but I can' t see that this is bad planning in here. Mr. Ward: I think what we are looking at is the-alternative of. bring another road out to the Main Road. Mr. Young: Well;, we certainly don't want to do that. I think that was a suggestion from Valerie- that we bring a road out to the Main Road. Certainly I would never bring a road out to the Main Road if I thought there was any other way around it. Maybe we if we brought this road back out, around here. I think that was suggested by you. Mr. Ward: Do you want to take a shot and see what you come up with. Mr. Young: Sure. I don' t think we have a choice. I am not sure where the water shed area is. Ms. Scopaz: The Core Water Shed area is the next road over. , Everything South of the Lilco Easement line is in the proposed core water shed area down to five hundred feet east of the rail road. So the entire southern half of the property is in the core water shed area. Mr. Young: We should avoid that area? Ms. Scopaz: I am just simply stating for the Boards expectations that. . . Planning Board- Page 21 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Young: I understand that, but Mr. Ward is asking me to draw something. I want to know if we should avoid that area. Mr. Ward: We were trying to off load some of that area. So you push it to the North. Mr. Young: Because of the water shed area? Mr. Ward: Well that and circulation we weren' t to enthralled in bringing that road up to the North Road. Mr. Young: I have not done the calculation on this as to how much vineyard we are destroying this way versus the way we have proposed it, but certainly you would wipe out this vineyard here. You are asking us to cluster around the high tension line, which you have asked in the past for us to avoid. Mr. Ward: You have, avoided it there by putting a buffer. Mr. Young: I understand, but now you have asked us to put more lots there. Mr. Ward: Can' t you leave the same buffer up there on each one. Mr. Young: I am sure we can. Mr. Ward: Also if you did that with the road through the middle you would be able to face your lots on tha.t: r..o,ad:..rather than onto Elijah' s and we would off load all those driveways onto Elijah' s. Leaving that as. a. collector street. Mr. Saland: You are really cutting the vineyard? Mr. Ward: You would do it a lot on the south side. You got a lot. . . Mr. Young: We understand, but someone just made the comment that we were doing less destruction of the vineyard this way. I doubt that this is true. ' But anyway we can certainly do those calculation by the map. I have had some experience with this reverse . . . plus these people here are going to have on the other side of Elijah' s Lane. At least those few houses there. You are going to have people' s back yards looking at their back yards. So it is not always a good concept to reverse these lots back up there. We will take back these comments. Mr. Ward: Alright. Mr. Young: Thank you. Mr. Orlowski: Mohring Enterprises,Inc.- Board to discuss this application for a major subdivision with the applicant. This Planning Board Page 22 July 25 , 1988 parcel is 15.902 acres located at Mattituck. SCTM #1000-122-3-1.1.. Mr. Cardinale: We had sent a letter earlier in the week. I understood that when my son called today that it was the intention of the Board to reject the letter. I was wondering why? I did not receive a letter I was just informed of the rejection. Mr. Orlowski: She is going to go get the letter now. What did the letter say. Mr. Cardinale: A suggestion was made in the letter. . In view of the amount of time and effort and the Health Department approvals. and the DEC approvals-have been made that we would agree to sign a covenant. I understand, I am not trying to second guess the Boards decision, to subdivide the commercial land. But if we draw the line at two hundred depth, we are going to end up with eight and twelve yards. I did not want to rush it in that matter. I thought it might be a possibility that we could get the approval with a covenant that we would immediately submit a plan for a subdivision of the commercial and the six and half acres that are there now. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. Ms. Scopaz: Is your Health Approval for a four lot subdivision? Mr. Cardinale: Yes. See what had happened originally was that it was hung up over there for a number of years. We had to give covenants relative to what we intended to and how we would do it in order to get the approval. Mr. Orlowski: I don' t know how we are going to do that. What you are asking us is to proceed with a minor subdivision? Mr. Cardinale: Yes,. But I would sign any covenant that you gentlemen would want to show that my intentions are not to try to circumvent what, your plans are. It is just that it took us together three and half years to get the health department approval. Once you make any change, what so ever, they are going require us to go through the entire procedure again. I know that it is inconceivable that we will be able to do anything with those front three lots. Which. wil.l not be changed. Ms. Scopaz: What three lots did -you say? Mr. Cardinale: The front lots facing on James Creek. Which are not an issue at this particular point. It was the division of the commercial property and the lot behind it. Ms. Scopaz: The only thing I want to say to the Board. is that the Health Department granted the approval under the assumption that it would be a four lot residential subdivision. What they Planning Board Page 23 July 25 , 1988 are asking to do is grant them the four lot and then they will go back to the health department again, saying that we changed our plans we are going to have a commercial use added to the four lots. I think that the Board- should take that into consideration. I think it' s initial recommendation, with regard. to requiring the commercial set off and making it clear to the Health Department what is actually intended. Which arecommercial use and/or residential lots. That the application should be looked at that way. Mr. Orlowski: Does the Board have any comments? Mr. Ward: The only thing I can see is I don' t know that. we can make the decision tonight without council as well as maybe inquiry on it. Mr. Cardinale: Again, I want to make it clear that I am not trying to circumvent any decision that. the Board is trying to make. Mr. Ward: I know. Mr. Cardinale: It is just that after three and half years and having plans with underground wiring and everything else plus three lots in the front. It could conceivably take a lengthy amount of time. I had no comment the last time I was here because I knew nothing at that time. I took the time to study it to find out if it would be easily be done. Its .not. Mr. Orlowski: You have no .trouble with the zoning line as it exists in setting off that lot in the future? Mr. Cardinale: I do not. My bother is a councilor. I am certainly not a lawyer and I don' t pose to be one. Mr. Philip Cardinale: I didn' t hear what you said. I think everybody knows the essential problem. You have seen it here all the time know. We don' t get anything pass the Health Department in .six months anymore. This one was a sager. Ms. Scopaz: Mr. Cardinale can you speak up please? Mr. P. Cardinale: Yes, what I was saying is that the generic problem is that sketch approval is of course good for six months but we can' t get anything passed the Health Department these days in less than a year or two. This one was even worse than most. The surprise to us is when we brought the file in, it was not a surprise to me that you wanted a new application. I understand that is the policy to reapply. Actually what we were looking for was an extension of the existing stamp but then when the Board finally looked at it, they said it would be a good idea to set it off. Which frankly, it would be. a. good idea. But what we are asking for is consideration for the fact that since this was approved, as it was submitted some time ago that in Planning Board Page 24 July 25, 1988 this instance that. you do not insist upon a set off at this. time. The problems with the DEC and the Health Department are going to be great, : time wise and other wise. By the time we get the Board' s approval here and go back to the Health Department their approval will be out of date. So, we are asking for a special consideration in view of the original sketch plan approval. Mr. Ward: How many business lots are there going to be? Mr. Cardinale: It is our intention to retain interest in it. We will be submitting elevations. A whole plan on what we extend to do. We will be 'retaining- interest in it, as we do in A & P Shopping Center. It will be done in a less commercial facade. Mr. Ward: Will it be one lot? Mr. Cardinale: It will be one commercial lot. Precisely how things would be set will have to be taken up with architects and what would be best' for the entire area. Ms. Scopaz: Could you elaborate what the problem was with the County. Did they put any restrictions on it. Mr. P. Cardinale: Yes. We had to file a covenant. The water was O.K. It had to do with the pools. We had to indicate that we will bring in all the necessary fill so that we can use a three pool system as opposed to a five pool system ,on. any of the lots. I am not that familiar with the rest of them since I did not handle them. I have to believe there were more problems than that. That is the 'only one I am aware of because I filed Covenants and Restrictions. I think there were early problems. I can find out. The only covenant they had me file was the cesspool covenant. Ms. Scopaz: So for each of the four houses you will have to bring in the fill. Mr. P. Cardinale: .Yes. All necessary fill. That is what they wanted. Ms. Scopaz: How many feet of fill are they asking you to bring in? Mr. A. Cardinale: We are anticipating, including the commercial property, we are figuring somewhere between eight and twelve thousand yards. We have gotten some commitments to put fill there. We have delays doing anything, based upon what is going to happen on the project.. We know in advance that we are looking for the additional residential and the commercial set off. That is it. I commit myself to that.- I will sign a covenant to that so that we are not delayed further on the other end. I am not trying to second guess the Board. I am only trying to expedite it. Planning Board Page 25 July 25, 1988 Mr. Orlowski: Well, with a covenant saying that before you do anything with that commercial property, you subdivide that lot off. Mr. Ward: Plus Health Department approval. It would have to be a combination of both. Mr. Orlowski: He would have to have that anyway. What he is saying is since he; has. it on this minor. . . Mr. Ward: Let the minor go and file the minor as it is and come back to us later with a further subdivision with the one lot. Mr. A. Cardinale: And that would include a very detailed drawing which I am working with the architects on that now. Mr. Orlowski: We would definitely want a covenant now though that that will be subdivided. Mr. A. Cardinale: I am totally agreeable to whatever you want. Mr. Orlowski: Why don' t you come up with some kind of covenant and we will send it to our attorney and we will. proceed with this map if we can. Mr. A. Cardinale: Thank you, gentlemen. Mr. P. Cardinale: Thank you for your time. Mr. Orlowski: O.K. The only other thing is next meeting. Yes. Mrs. Wacker: My name Ronnie Wacker. I am the president of the North Fork Environmental. Council. I want to congratulate the members of the Planning Board for being able to sit here night after night or week after week and listen to the accumulated demand of developers. We are. all in a very mannered orderly way presiding over the death of Southold Town. It is very difficult to watch. We, the volunteer group, such as we are, see it. There are so many lawyers, so many consultants at high wages giving advice of this. Bombarding you with information it is very difficult to keep up with it. It is. just about impossible for us. It angers us. We wish we were much larger, much bigger. What I would .like to ask you is, I don't know if this would be out of order for me or not. I. do think it is about time we have a moratorium. It has been six years since we asked for a moratorium. It was not granted at that time, .1982. We are now waiting for the revised GEIS to be given. to the Town. I understand there was some problem with the typist. The typist did not get notes, so three months went by and nothing was done. Something most be done. We can' t just go on month after months and year after year. I would like to ask you, if you gentlemen would vote on whether you think a moratorium, until the master plan is completely approved and the GEIS is completed? Whether Planning Board Page 26 July 25, 1988 you would approve a moratorium. Just for that length of time. I don' t- think it would be any more than six months. I do think we must stop this. I don' t blame each of the developers, but when you consider the cummulative effect none of them consider the impact. This is what you have to consider. In the consideration of this you are overwhelmed with work. There is no question about it. Would it- be sensible to have a moratorium until the master plan is completed. What I would like to ask you tonight is, would you vote on this? This may be totally out of order. I don't know what you have to go through. Mr. Orlowski: What the Town .Board would. do is form a committee and have somebody look into it, like they have done with everything else. Mrs. Wacker: I know, in other words it will take another six months. Mr. Orlowski: We sat here since 1983 begging for a master plan. We put one together, which we thought was a fine piece of work: It was endorsed by the Suffolk County Planning and Suffolk Planner as the best master plan produced in all of Suffolk County. It seems politics and friendship and everything has gotten involved and it is still not being adopted. Back in 1983 they requested a moratorium until the master plan was adopted. We would have been sitting here for six years doing nothing. Personally I. don't- believe in a moratorium. It is a confiscation of land and the rights of what they have with. that land. Mrs. Wacker: No, it is not. .It is .just holding back. Mr. Orlowski: There is no guarantee that it will ever go • forward. The way it has to go forward is that the people that are elected have to start making decisions and not forming committees for other people to make decisions. Other wise we elect committees instead of politicians and council people. We need a master plan, we need it bad. You see what is happening. All these site plans and commercial. properties are coming. I don' t see how thet are ever going to get used. If we had the master plan in place everyone would now what is going on. Nobody -knows. Mrs. Wacker: Just think, if in 1982 we had a moratorium that said "O.K. members of the Town Board you get your master plan in place six months to a year" . It would have been done. Then you would- have had the people whose interest are in developing the land yapping at their heals saying O.K. get on with it. That has not happened. We are all alike. We all figure lets put off the tough decisions to a later date, when it is easier. I think without a dead line nothing is going to happen. Mr. Ward: Is your thrust primarily looking on business? Planning Board Page 27 July 25 , 1988 Mrs. Wacker: NO, I am just looking at the development of the open space. That is all.. It is not business. Business actually has to gain from a moratorium. It has to .gain from environmental interest. Because business is going to be gone if you don' t have the area around here. If you don't have the attractive place for people to come out to. We need some kind of dead line, that is why I am asking if ' you would vote. I don' t know if you are allowed to, but if you are I wish you would. Mr. Orlowski: I don' t think any body listens when we vote anyway. I don't remember sending a recommendation that ever got followed through on. We sent over a paper that is worth about one hundred thousand dollars three years ago and it is still sitting there. A moratorium is just putting something off that has to be done now. I don' t think a moratorium is the way to go at all I don' t believe in it. I think decisions have to be made by the people that are elected. They are just not being made. Mrs. Wacker: We went your way in 1982. Here we are in 1988 still saying that. the politicians should be making the decisions. Isn' t there a way to force them to make the decisions? Mr. Orlowski: I think they have to make that discissions themselves. I see that. Riverhead Town has had a moratorium on certain parts for the last three .or four years and they haven' t gotten anywhere. I don' t think it is the way to do it. Mrs. Wacker: You can' t have a moratorium for-three or four years. Mr. Orlowski: Tell Riverhead that. Mrs. Wacker: I don't know. Maybe they are doing it wrong. It just seems to me that we must pay attention. Mr. Orlowski: We have been saying that. Mrs. Wacker: I know you have. All I am saying is give them a . dead line. I, you, the members of the Planning Board, were in favor of a moratorium, I think it would carry a good deal of weight with the Town Board. Mr. Mullen: Unfortunately, I will have to disagree with you because we have minimum weight with the Town Board. Specific situations, the master plan, I commend you thanking us and I sympathize with you. I recommend that you give consideration to perhaps visiting the Town Board with your membership and tell them just what you are telling us. Because if we say yes, they say no. If we say hot they say. cold. That is the way it is, unfortunately. We can not gear them to our thinking. Mrs. Wacker: O.K. Mr. Orlowski: I would like to see them do something without forming a. committee. Planning Board Page 28 July 25 , 1988 Mrs. Wacker: No more committees. Mr. Ward: Let us say that we do put. a moratorium for a year, what would you recommend doing differently than what we are doing different now? Mrs. Wacker: I do not think you can do anything differently because you have certain laws to abide by. I am not blaming you. I am just saying that your recommendation for a moratorium. Mr. Ward: I still do not know in my mind why we should have one. Mrs. Wacker: There should have been one six years ago. Mr. Ward: There was a limited one on business. Mrs. Wacker: I don'' t recall the one you are talking about. Mr. Ward: I think it went for six months and then expired. Mr. Mullen: As soon as you are talking moratorium you are only lighting a fire on all. of the developers and they will be coming in here till. . . Mrs. Wacker: They haven't needed afire. They have been lit for six years. They have come in and taken over the whole town. Mr. Ward: If there was an issue say residential .-where you were saying from your point of view that the clustering of subdivisions should preserve ninety percent not fifty percent. I do not know what the issue is, that is what I am missing. If we are missing the mark in what we are doing then I can say if there was something very, very important to do than I would say it would make sense. I don' t know where you are coming from. Mrs. Wacker: It is just to get the master plan approved. Mr. Ward: Then we would recommend to address the Town Board on this issue. Mrs. Wacker: Yes, but your recommendation from the Town Board will hold. a great deal of weight. If I go to them and. say I think we need a moratorium, they, are going to say thank you very much for coming we certainly appreciate. Mr. Ward: You are saying a moratorium would force the Town Board to adopt the master plan? Mrs. Wacker: I yes I do. There are people who have financial interest in developing on a short term basis. They would be after the Town Board. Mr. Latham: Excuse me. If the master plan were enacted we would still be talking to these people tonight about the same things Planning Board Page 29 July 25 , 1988 basically. I don' t think that would change anything. In this Country our system here is when you buy something, when you buy a piece of. land you have the right to develope it, to sell it or build on it. Mrs. Wacker: Then what we are saying is that we will just lie back and let them come in and do .what ever they want with our property. Mr. Latham: No. Mrs. Wacker: The Town has to govern, make decisions as to how much of the land will be developed. Mr. Ward: To address a moratorium there has to be some very specific reasons why you are doing it. It is not going to be upheld by the courts if there aren' t. Mrs. Wacker: Exactly. Mr. Ward: This is why I was asking you, residentially are there certain issues before you environmentally that you feel they need to be addressed. That is the point you have to address. Mrs. Wacker: The point is that the master plan should be completed. Mr. Ward: But that, is not a purpose to have. a..moratorium. Mrs. Wacker: It is. According to SEQRA, it is. If you have a different purpose, to have a master plan completed or what ever. In any case it is a recommendation I am offering you. Mr. Orlowski: I think we all would like to see you go through the Town Board and jump on them because we have been trying to do it for a long time. Mrs. Fletcher: My name is Linda Fletcher. I am on the Board of the NFC and I am also the president of the New Suffolk Civic Association. On a recent trip, I was in Nantucket, I spent a lot of time in the Planning Board there. I brought home quite a bit of material that I. still have not really gone over as well as I would like to. One thing that .they did in Nantucket is that they put a cap on building permits that were issued residentially every year. I spoke to them, they have had some success with it. There have been problems with it. When I look at the total number of acreage in one meeting, I look at this and I ask when will this stop. And it won' t stop till there is nothing left. When there is °nothing left this place is going to look like Nassau County. It will, what else would it look like. I wondered if the Planning Board ever talked with places like Nantucket. I have been to Chadum. Ma. , they are in the process of revising their master plan. They face similar problems, these areas. Planning Board Page 30 July 25, 1988 Mr. Latham: Excuse 'me. I think Ruth Olivia, before she was a council woman, talked to the people. I remember Nantucket some years ago. You might want to talk to her about it. She is now on the Town Board. I think she brought the same thing up five or six years ago. You might ask her. Mrs. Fletcher: Have you all considered other ways to level off this? Mr. Orlowski: With out a doubt. Mr. Ward: I don' t think anybody is going to level things off. The economy does that. The thing that we can do is do proper planning. Proper planning, at the present time we are, in most of our large acre subdivisions, we are saving fifty percent of it. I think that we have certain proposals before the Town Board now and in Code committee which will allow for further clustering. Tighter clustering, which we could even save up to ninety percent on certain parcels. Those types of things, in my opinion, are where our next step will be in terms of further preservation. I don' t know where, from my own point of view, a moratorium will serve that issue. I think that you would be better, in my opinion, to seek out other codes, in other communities as to how they are doing it. And give us information as to how they are accomplishing their densities and how. the planning is being done. Because history has said that there has never been a planning board that has controlled plot developement or stopped developement all it has: done is. maybe created proper planning verses improper planning. Mrs. Fletcher: So you would be interested in seeing this. Mr. Ward: Certainly. Mr. Orlowski: I think I made the comment one time that we did not need a moratorium because you had the Planning Board. If you ask half of these developers in Town who have been here two or three years.. There are a couple here four or five years already. We are doing pretty good, I think. Mrs. Wacker: I think you are. Mr. Orlowski: It is scary to have such a fragile area and such a beautiful area and not even have a master plan. There is no master plan in effect in this Town. It is a shame. The biggest thing is that we have people concerned about the environment and concerned about development on the board. Both groups do not like the master plan. Both groups do not like something about it. We have .been saying for the past five years, just adopt. something and change it later. Mr. Ward: The problem is if you work for the perfect document, there never will be . one. Our feeling on it was that we were so far ahead by recommending its adoption eventhough it, may have Planning Board Page 31 . July 25 , 1988 some flaws to it. We felt it was better to adopt and keep going and then make modifications where you had problems then to just do nothing. Mr. Edwards: That was recommendation at the time. Mr. Mullen: These moratoriums are very difficult in the legal area too. The litigation is unbelievable. It evidentially comes out of the tax payers pocket. You have to be very, very cautious how you proceed. I am not opposed to it, but it is a way of doing it too. I suggest what you do is discuss it with the Town Board and A. get the mast plan approved and B. we can always change it. Nothing is perfect. Mrs. Wacker: Without it, we just feel that the master plan will not be approved for a long, long time. The Department of State has written a paper on moratoriums, and if it is for a definite purpose for a limited time that it will survive court challenge. Back in 1982, when we asked them about it, they weren' t so sure. They have had so many cases. Mr. Latham: One big step that has been done a few years ago and nobody talks about without a master plan is two acre zoning. I think that was a big step. Mr. Orlowski: Go over there and give them hell and we will support you. Mr. 'Orlowski: Next meeting, the 15th of August. I will entertain the motion. Mr. Edwards: So moved. Mr. Ward: Second. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those , in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards.. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. We are also going to have a special meeting on some of these time framed procedure's. Next Thursday afternoon at four o'clock. Mr. Ward: So moved. Mr. Latham: Seconded. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those, in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards.. Planning Board Page 32 July 25 , 1988 Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So moved. Mr. Orlowski: I will make a motion to adjourn. . Mr. Mullen: So moved. Mr. Ward: Seconded. Mr. Orlowski: Motion made and seconded. Any questions on the motion? All those in favor? Vote of the Board; Ayes: Orlowski, Mullen, Latham, Ward, Edwards. Mr. Orlowski: Opposed? So ordered. Meeting was adjourned. at 9:15 p.m. Respectfully submitted, P11 M- M. Thorp, Se retary Southold Town Planning Board Bennett Orlowski, Jr. , C irman. RECEIVED ED AND FILE'D BY THE SOUTHOLD TOWN N C 1211K DATE ��8�' I-1OURor m Town Clerk, Town of .Soy.Lel d