HomeMy WebLinkAboutTR-02/19/1997 R
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Albert J. Krupski,President y Gy Town Hall
John Holzapfel, Vice President c < 53095 Main Road
Jim king_=i—: o ,? P.O. Box 1179
Martin H. Garrell �1, �� Southold, New York 11971
Peter Wenczel �Oj �`a� Telephone (516) 765-1892
Fax (516) 765-1823
BOARD OF TOWN TRUSTEES
TOWN OF SOUTHOLD
M1 N1JTES
FEBRUARY 1.9, 1997
PRESENT WERE: John Holzapfel., Vice-President
Peter Wenczel., Member
Martin H. Garr.ell, Member
James King., Member
Jill. Doherty, Clerk
_ CALL MEETING TO ORDER
PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE
NEXT FIELD INSPECTION: Wed. March 1.9, 1997 at 1pm
NEXT TRUSTEE BOARD MEETING: Wed.. , March 26L, 1997 7P.M.
WORKSESSTON: 6:00 p.m.
APPROVE MINUTES: Approve minutes. of December 1996 Regular Meeting:,.
January 10, 1997 Special Meeting. and January 21., 1997 Organizational
meeting:.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded. by TRUSTEE
WENCZEL to approve the minutes-.. ALL. AYES.
I . MONTHLY REPORT: The Trustees monthly report for January 1997 :
A check for $3,332. 41 was forwarded to the Supervisor' s Office for
the General. Fund.
II. PUBLIC. NOTICES: Public Notices are posted on. the Town. Clerk' s.
Bulletin Board. for review.
III . AMENDMENTS./WAIVERS./CHANGES:
1. Samuels. and. Steelman on behalf of DENNIS. UDE. requests: a
Waiver to demolish existing house and construct new home. and garage.
greater then 751 from. MHW as. per survey dated January 2,4, 1997 ..
Located. 1.2.27 Pine Neck Road, Southold.. SCTM #70-5-3.6.
Board of Trustees. 2 bruary 19, 1997.
A motion was made. by TRUSTER WENCZEL. and seconded by TRUSTEE.
HOLZAPFEL. to approve the waiver with a. staked line of haybales and
silt fence at 75' line. ALL AYES..
2. Costello Marine on behalf of HELEN RUST. requests. an amendment to
Permit #4238 to reconstruct. l2.' X 24' boat .ramp' and upper retaining,
wall, including: a 8 ' X 27' timber walkway between the: upper retaining
wall ancl lower bulkhead... Located. Wunneweta. Road, Nassau.. Point. SCTR
#11.1-14-34.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL .and. seconded by TRUSTEE KING
to approve. application as amended. and. 15' Buffer which wa's suggested-
by TRUSTEE. KRUPSKI. ALL. AYES.
3. Proper-T Permit Services on behalf of 14ICHAEL SLADE requests
an amendment to Permit ##4440 to replace. inkind/inp.lace approx. 40
l..f. of existing. func.tional bulkhead.. Reco.nstruct. approx. 125 l..f. of
existing functional- bulkhead by adding new. sheathing on. the. seaward
side of the existing piles. Replace inkind/inplace 4 existing.
functional docks.. Located 1435 West Road, Cutchogue.. SCTM #110-7-26.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE.
WENCZEL to approve application as, described. ALL AYES.
4. STEPHEN PARZIALE requests- 'a Transfer of Permit #118-4-11 from
Joan Cacciole to Stephen Parziale and amend the permit to add the
secondary retaining. wall. approx. 90' with two approx. 10' returns as
per survey dated 10/1.1/95.
A motion. was made. by TRUSTEE_HOLZAPFEL_ and seconded by TRUSTEE KING
to approve the above.. O.K. by TRUSTEE KRUPSKI. ALL AYES.
5. Greenport Dock on behalf of ERNEST GAEBEL requests an amendment-
to Permit #4808 to change dock as per DEC approval: a total length of
114' out from bulkhead and 15' off property line, 4.' X 82' catwalk 3 '
X 1..6' ramp and 2 - 6' X 20' f.l.oats with associated piles- Dock will
go out no further then neighbors to the north.
Located 1765 Westview Drive, Mattituck.. SCTM. #107.-7-7 .A motion. was
made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTER WENCZEL
to Table this approval until further notice. All AYES.
IV. PUBLIC HEARINGS:
THIS I.S A PUBLIC HEARING IN THE MATTER. OF THE FOLLOWING: APPLI.CATI:ONS'
FOR PERMITS UNDER- THE WETLANDS ORDINANCE OF THK TOWN OF SOUTHOLD. I
HAVE. AN AFFIDAVIT OF PUBLICATION: FROM THX SUFFOLK TIMES. PERTINENT
CORRESPONDENCE MAY BE READ PRIOR TO ASKING. FOR COMMENTS. FROM. THE:
PUBLIC.
PLEASR KEEP YOUR COMMENTS ORGANIZED AND BRIEF:
FIVE ( 5) MINUTES OR LESS,' IF POSSIBLE
1. Warren Sambach, Sr. on behalf of GARDINERS BAY ESTATES_
HOMEOWNERS ASSOC. requests a Wetland Permit to install 100.+/- l.f..
wood retaining. wall, repair existing retaining wall deteriorated
planking as per survey dated-. February 6, 1.997. .Located, Dogwood Lane &
Bay View Drive, East. Marion. SCTM. #37-5-23 .
Board of Trustees. ' 3 bruary '19, 1997
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Is there anybody that wants- to speak for this.
application?
WARREN SAMBACH:: I have nothing to say except my name is Warren
Sambaeh from Gardiners Bay Estates. The. purpos:e of this retaining
wall is. just to clean up the area., get. rid. of the. weeds, and to
prevent the wash out from the embankment.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Is there anybody else- who- would- like. to speak?
o.k. I.' ll just say I went out myself. and looked at that and it. makes
complete sense. the way it' s built and. the. way it.' s designed it will
help, so that I think it's a good idea. Any other comments?
I' ll make a. motion to close the hearing. Oh I'm sorry CAC. I should
just.. . . recommends approval with the stipulation. that the. applicant
minimize any disturbance to shore line during the repair. I' ll make. a.
motion that we close the hearing.
. A moti.on. was. made to close the hearing by TRUSTEE.. HOLZAPFEI and
seconded. by TRUSTEE CARRELL. ALL AYES.
A motion was made to approve Warren Sambachs application on behalf
of Gardiners Estates by TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEIL and seconded by TRUSTEE
KING. ALL AYES.
2. ROBERT AdiPi.etro on. behalf of. FRANK VALENTI requests a Wetland
Permit to construct. a single family dwelling, sanitary system and
gravel. driveway as, per survey dated 7/10/95. Located. south-west
corner of Route 48 'and Route 25, Gr.eenport. SCTM #k34.-1-8.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.: Is there anybody who would like to speak about
this application? o.k. Does anybody in the: public have any comments.
pro or con? o.k. Marty go ahead I'm sorry?
I'm just. . .
TRUSTEE GARRELL: I looked at that and. I. had no problem with it except
the size of it' s so small., right now there' s a cat feeder out there
and it kind of looks like the house would have to be the size of the
cat feeder almost, seriously it must_ be a very smal.l. foot print.
MR. ADIPIETRO: 850 sq.. ft.
TRUSTEE GARRELL.: yeah o.k.
MR. ADIPIETRO: That:' s. the smallest the. town will allow..
TRUSTEE GARRELL.: Did you ever speak to. Mr. Bruce about. that, the guy
who has the property next door to the old. Jensen. hous:e?
MR. ADIPIETRO: No
TRUSTEE GARRELL.: o.k. You know. I saw the house was sided and. it seems
like it would work, the only thing I would, I. would wonder is if we
could possibly avoid a turf, have sort of a non' turf.buffer above.
that wetland. In other words., no lawn..
MR.. ADIPIETRO: Oh. o.k.
TRUSTEE- CARRELL: That would be my only suggestion. for it.
MR. ADIPIETRO: That would. be. along the south?
TRUSTEE GARRELL.: yeah along the south, southwest..
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Southwest you think?
MR. ADIPIETRO.: Southwest..
TRUSTEE. GARRELL: Yeah where it comes. above that end.
TRUSTEE GARRELL: John you took a look at it.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL_: Yeah I did too. And you know, I had the same
pr.oblem. as you did Marty. As a matter of fact, I saw, I saw 'the. 2
stakes and I couldn't figure .out where the other 2 were..
TRUSTER CARRELL: I. know..
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL: It was so small., that. I was. a little confused..
Board of Trustees 4 bruary 19, 1997
So .I didn't see any problem either with: it. as it stands_. CAC, and. I
just mentioned this_ to you, talked about the driveway as not being
MR.- ADIPIETRO: Not being black topped.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: Right.
MR. ADIPIETRO: Gravel
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL..: Right.
MR. ADIPIETRO.: Stone.-
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.:. Or. some. .pervious, some pervious_ surface:.So: that. it.
doesn't increase the run off.. And they did have a question about the
cesspoo.l. site, but from the survey-it`s about as far away as possible .
as you could ever make: it., in: that: situation so. Any other.' questions?
TRUSTEE GARRELL.: Isn.' t that the Greenport sewer district?
TRUSTER HOLZAPFEL..: Not this property.
MR. ADIPIETRO.: Water district., but not sewer district.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I'm going to make a motion that we close the
hearing than..
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL. and seconded. by TRUSTEE
GARRELL to ,close the. hearing..
A motion was made. by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE
WENCZEL. to approve application with. per:vious gravel. driveway and
haybales between the house and wetlands. Also a non turf buffer
between house and wetland. ALL. AYES.
3 . Harold Reebel on. behalf of REYDON SHORES PROPERTY OWNERS ASSOC.
requests a ten year Wetland Permit to maintenance dredge entrance to
a depth oaf 4' below MLW, approx, 400 c.y. , dredgge area around
floating docks_ on north bulkheads and areas. adjacent. .to west bulkhead-
to depth of 4' below MLW, approx. 200 c.y. . Spoil 'to be placed. above
spring high tide on. dunes for beach nourishment and. back fill of
bulkheads.. Also, to replace docks. a thru h (3 ' X. 14' ) ,to 3 ' X 201 ,
repair/replace all other floating doers when needed inkind/inplace,
addition of 2., 3' X 20' finger. docks. As per plans submitted:.. Located
end of Reydon Drive., Reydon Shores... SCTM #80-3-21.1.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Is there anybody who would like to. speak-in- favor
of this application? is. there anybody who. would like to speak against
this. application? o.k. And we all looked at it, we did have a concern
about. . .
CLERK: Yeah, I never got back in touch wi.th. Mr.Reebel about the pipe.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL_-. Q.K.
CLERK:I have to talk to him about that.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL..: CAC, just for the record, recommends approval, but
is concerned with the -dune. management restoration plan being allowed
for a ten year period. Circumstances may alter during- that time, the
counselor would. like. to see that period. shortened and/ or plan be.
reviewed after five: year..
MR. MESKILL: My only concern is the duration of time. can. change
within that ten year period, for the dune restoration. . .
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.: Right, and it 'mi.ght. . ..
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL:. It could. end up being 30 feet tall if they have to
dredge i.t .every year.. I think that. make.s some sense. I'm just not
sure how you. go about, you know. The same. thing that happened down. on.
Whickams Creek, you have a hill. 4Q feet tall of dredge spoils.
TRUSTEE KING: I was there today and I forgot all. about that pipe. I
thought today would be easier.
TRUSTEE KING:: Who owns the: property to the. . . on the other side of
the channel c.omingg. down..
Board of Trustees 5 bruary 19, 1.997
CLERK: Peconic
TRUSTEE KING.: Remember we said it would be a good idea if: they could.
fill that.. . .
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: Peconic. Land. Trust.
Jill called..
CLERK: I called. him..
TRUSTEE KING: How did he feel about that?
CLERK: Mr. Reebel hasn't gotten back to me. But he said that he's
always worked well with. them., and. he' s pretty sure that they will be
agreeable:.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL:: They actually own. half of the channel., which.
presents a. problem.. If they' re going to dredge, we don' t have a
letter from them saying.. . .
CLERK: Yeah I never thought of. that...
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL: Do you know? I just
CLERK: yeah
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL: When you had s:aid. that the other day.
CLERK.: Yeah.. I never thought of that cause it doesn' t show that on
the map.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: We need some clarification. Jill had called him.,
and he. said. they split the channel.. He has.. no problem putting the
sand in there: but, we don't have any letters from. . .
TRUSTEE, KING: We should get. a letter.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: I. hate to. . .
TRUSTEE KING: We should. get a letter.
TRUSTER HOLZAPFEL.: Is there. a time limit an this., or a window.
CLERK: I don' t know. Usually March 15th.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: There's nobody here. from the home owners?
CLERK: No. Mr. Reebel' s in. Nass,au county.
TRUSTER HOLZAPFEL.: " I don' t think we can approve something that' s
somebody else' s land.
CLERK: How far.,. How wide. is that? Is it only 25' wide there?
TRUSTEE. KING: Yeah, it' s probably 3.0' or more..
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It might be. 5.0. all. th:e way across.
TRUSTEE KING,:. Probably 40' wide: anyway.
CLERK: Cause they are only asking for 25' . So maybe there only asking
for there property.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: To dredge their part.
CLERK: Their part.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: So we can approve it with the idea.,. they dredge to
their 'property, and obviously we.' 11 amend:. it if they want. to. We can
do that. by phone. Does that make sense:?
TRUSTEE GARRELL: Yeah o.k. Yeah
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL_: Yeah, I.'m sure. that.' s 50.
TRUSTEE GA RML-. Yeah that must be 50' across then.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Yeah. It' s pretty far.
TRUSTEK GARRELL.: It-' s a pretty good reach.. It might be 501 .
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: O.k. Any other comments? I' 1.1 make a motion that.
we close the: hearing-.
A motion. was. made to close the hearing: by TRUSTEE_ HOLZAPFEL and
seconded by TRUSTEE: GARREL . TRUSTER WENZCEL ABSTAINED from this.
hearing.
A- mot ion was: made. by TRUSTER HOLZAPFEL. and seconded by TRUSTER KING
to approve this application with review after. 5 years as per CAC
recommendations. Recommending to upgrade. road. rur .=off.
TRUSTEE. WENZCEL. ABSTAINED from this motion..
Board of Trustees 6 bruary 19, 1.997
4. En-Consultants Inc. , on behalf of. STEPAN MYNAKYAN requests: a.
Wetland Permit to insta11. 102 l..f. of timber retaining wall. plus an
18' return on west side. On east side, wall. will. be built landward of:
neighbors gabion. wallwhich encroaches. on subject property-. A
short return be. remove to accommodated proposed- wall. Approx.. 2.00
c..y. of clean. fill will be trucked in, and construct a 41. x 120'
stairway with 3 - 4' X 5' landings:. Located 2375 Soundview Ave. ,
Mattituck. SCTM #94-1-21..
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.:. Is there anybody in the public wishes to speak,
pro or con? Peter questions over there?
TRUSTEE WENCZE.L.:. No, we don't need. & coastal erosion. permit?
CLERK.: We: have the money for.. that.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: No other questions..
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.: It' ll make a motion that we: close the hearing.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL and. s:econded by TRUSTEE KING
to close the hearing. ALL AYES.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and seconded by TRUSTEE KING.
to approve this application for a wetland permit and a coastal.
erosion permit on the: bases of an inspection prior to construction.
ALL. AYES..
5. J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of. HAROLD SCHWERDT requests a
Wetland. Permi.t to remove 94' of concrete block retaining wall and
reconstruct inplace with 8.0' timber wall with a 7' return on both
ends and backfill. with 5. c.y. of clean sand from. upland. source.
Located 440 Oak Ave. , Southold.. SCTM #p77-2-1.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.: Is there anybody who wishes to speak, for or
against?
MR. JUST: I'm Glenn Just from J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of Mr.
Shwerdt. I would ask the. board at this time if they could maybe
put off the decision and vote on this one more time. I don' t know if.
Jill. has let the full board. know what' s happened since we met at the
site, about. a. month and a. half ago. I met. with the full board of
trustees there a. little while after. that.. Lou Chiarella,. D.E.C. met
with, I believe. AL.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: AL. Right.
MR. JUST: Then. & third person, I believe CAC was- there, and than
folks from Suffolk County Soil Conservation Service were there. I 'm
still trying to coordinate the comments of all four parties. I've
gotten respons.e,- one response from Chiarella, nothing from Albert
unfortunately.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: But you know our feelings from. the field
inspection.
MR. JUST: I think Mr. Schwerdt wou.ld. probably settle on, either a
permit- to reconstruct the concrete: wall, inkind/inp.lace within 1.8." at
this time. Instead of going: 7 ' further seaward-
TRUSTEE.- HOLZAPFEL.: Right.
MR.. JUST: But that's not, I don' t have. the permission to do that., .or
the right t.o do that at this time.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Right. That's where I think we were at. When we
met.
MR. JUST: Chi.ar.el.la' s response to me didn' t mention any
alternatives., which is unlike the D.E.C. , normally tel.l. you do this,
do this., do this, but don't do that. It' s just a flat out "No" . I've
met with him earlier today, and with Jimmy-. King.. . . they had. no time.
to discuss this.
Hoard of Trustees ; 7 bruary 19, 1997
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: We' ll be happy to table it, but. let us know
before. . . at least. .
MR. JUST: I'm just trying to coordinate the. four different. agencies.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: But you know I had talked to Jill earlier in the
week about. it, or last week I guess, and that' s What she had said...
That you weren't sure what. was going: on.,, but- you know our, position...
MR.. JUST: Yours is the one- definite that I. do know of.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL O.K. Fine
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: We. didn't feel that there was: a preexisting wall
there.
MR. JUST: The concrete wall,. I think you guys said, was legit. Cause:
it was shown on survey, but that. timber wall., or the concrete wall in
front of the brick wall seaward of the: timber wall, didn' t show on.
the survey either. So that was illegal., or whatever term. you want to.
choose for it.. The only thing that we do know. . .
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Is there a wooden bulkhead there.
MR. JUST: Yeah, but seaward, just landward of that: is a concrete wall
that's shown an the survey.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Landward of that.
MR. JUST: Just landward about 8 or 9 inches:. And that' s the only
thing. . .
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: In back of the- timber wall, towards the house,
between the house and the timber wall.
MR. JUST: And that' s the only thing we could, that definitely
substantiates . . .
TRUSTEE WENCZEL:. So that must be up on the. wall.
MR. JUST: It' s right there, I.t.' s the same. height. as the. timber. wall.
If you: can remember we were all standing where the drain came down to
the end of' the road.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL..: yeah
MR. JUST: The timber wrapped around and ran back up to the- concrete
and wrapped back around, and. went back right up the road..
TRUSTEE. WENGZEL: So why would you want to, replace the concrete wall?
It' s in. back of: the: timber wall.. Why would you want to?
MR. JUST: Because: the whole idea is that timber wall is just
seaward. . .
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: It' s starting to go.
MR. JUST: It just isn' t going- to make: it.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Oh I see!
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: That' s what we had said at the end, is, that' s
what they're going to replace:.
MR. JUST: We originally thought. that,. that. concrete block wall that
was seaward of the timber wall., was the one originally shown on. the
survey.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL,: Right but. it wasn't.
MR. -JUST: I.t. was the. concrete wall, No. It wasn' t.
TRUSTEE. WENCZEL.: o.k.. I just wanted to make sure we agreed on that.
MR. JUST: I. agree- with you guys- for a change....
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.-. CAC, Ken are you o.k. with what were talking about?
MR. MESKILL.: Yeah., I don' t have any familiarity with this project.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: O.k.
MR. MESKILL: I didn.'t. visit it myself, and I don't have the plans.
with me.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: It's been around for 3 or 4 months., that's why.
MR. MESKILL: Well I'11. get it tabled for now so don.' t worry about
it.
Board of Trustees. 8 bruary 19, 1997
TRUSTEK HOLZAPFEL: O.k. L' 1.1 make a motion. that we table this
application.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: and seconded by TRUSTEE KING
to table this. application. ALL AYES..
6. J.M.O. Consulting on behalf of ANDREW J.. MCGOWAN, JR. requests
a Wetland Permit. to install. 110' of. gabions= (2' X 4.' X. 6' ) along. a
severely eroded shoreline. Gabions. shall then be covered with +75'
c.y. of clean sand to be trucked in. from: an upland source- and then,
planted with Amer.ican. Beach. Grass 12" on Center. Located. New Suffolk.
Ave. , Cutchogue. SCTM #116.-6-18.,.19,20.
TRUS.TEX HOLZAPFEL.: Is there anybody in the public that. wishes to
speak., pro or con?
MR. JUST: We met. on. site earlier today with trustee King and Lou.
Chiarella and. Chuck Hami.lton. from DEC. I believe the full. board.
made an inspection, at the last inspection, site. I wasn't aware of
the whole history- of the site,. th.er.e' s. 4 groin.' s on the property.
It' s obvious that 2 were starting off the beach at the south end
there, and that' s where most of the erosion is taking place. I.t' s
washed about 9/10 seaward., landward of the existing points. As we
all. know that body of water is. dredged. twice. a. year. by Suffolk
County, the channel comes within about 50' of the beach right there.
I 've noticed. it. myself, or I think Jimmy King to when we were there,
said to that the county, permit calls for that sand that is pumped
out to be placed on that beach.. it' s never been placed there before...
Yeah and. the DEC decided to go back and contact, I believe it.' s Mr.
Rogers from County Public Works Dept. and ask why it' s not in place.
there. Because as part of the permit to dredge, they' re supposed to
replant those silts right- there. But whatwe-Ire w 're asking for is the .
gabions run perpendicular to the landward end of the groins.. There
would be a. barrier structure, just. there for a final solution. I
think if you wanted. to go with that, it would be something that' s.
not seen, it would be buried. by sand, and planted on top.. The north
wind really takes a pounding there.. Doctor lost about 42' beach front
in the last 3. years. of. the document. Then again that structure would
just be there for a final solution. God forbid theree was a big storm,,
or anything like that would come close to the house..
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Glenn the one concern, or question I think we had,
I remember was rarely do we say move it out further into. . . we don' t
usually say that. But, in this particular case we thought it would
make much more sense: to match. it up to the. groin that is there
instead of providing: that little cell for the water to move in.
MR. JUST: That was. brought up to me on site. I'm surpri.sed. by the
boards response that it didn' t seem to agree: with you.. I. just didn' t.
think I would. be able to get away with it.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.:, Right..
MR. JUST: They wouldn' t go for that.. That.' s. why I never applied for '
it. It makes sense: to me to tie them all. in. together.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL_: Your. client would be willing to. get 5 more feet of
land?
MR. JUST: Most defiantly, he' s lost 30 or 40 right out his.. back
pocket.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: Fine, does. anybody else have a. comment., pro or
con? O.k. CAC made those same. comments Jill just said. I.' ll make. a.
motion to close. the hearing.
Board of Trustees_ 9 bruary 19, 1997
A motion was made to close the hearing by TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL. and
seconded. by TRUSTEE WENCZEL.. ALI, AYES.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL. and seconded. by TRUSTEE: KING
to approve the. application with. amendment. that the gabion will.
attach. to southern groins. and north. 1,0' from the second groin.
ALL. AYES..
7. J.M.O. Consulting an behalf of STEPHEN & SUSAN TUTHILL. requests:
a Wetland Permit. to reconstruct existing 3' X. 15' walk,. 6' X 60. 5'
catwalk, 3 ' X 1.8' ramp: and, to install. a 10' X 2.0.' float. and a. 3 ' X.
66' extension to the landward end of the existing walk. Located. 1895
Naugles Drive, Matti.tuck. SCTM #99-4-21.
TRUSTEE: HOLZAPFEL: Is. there anybody who wishes- to speak., for or
against this application?
MR. JUST: On behalf of. Mr. and Mrs.. Tuthill who are both, here
tonight. In case any questions, direct. it to them if they don't mind.
They want to restore: the existing dock.. This section: of Matti-tuck
creek, most of the stick docks- seem to be 4 x 6 or 4x4
width wise.. I. guess alot of them had them commerci_alixed at one time-
Because of the structure_ of the creek. The dock is, the landward end
is about 60' short of the. wetland. We want to: extend the dock
landward back to the wetlands so we: don't have to trip over the
wetlands. back to the high margins., going back forth on the dock. This_
is kind. of a. uni_que situation, with the floats. It's. interesting,
.it' s a 10 x 2.0' float.. Mr. Tuthill has a friend who' s willing to give
him another float. That' s what we' re trying to put in.. The new floats.
going to be. constructed. for the site. But. the neat thing. that I. think
about Ma.ttituck Creek is we've always. talked about, you always have
to make the boat fit. the creek., and. not the. creek. fit the. boat..
Mat.tituck Creek is a very, very deep creek....Mr. Tuthill wants to
bring. a 27 ' sailboat in; and with the depths there the sailboat could
tie up to a floater there. Without extending the docking further
seaward. Whereas alot of creeks., where there. docking where. it' s: 100
or 200 feet. wide.. Here it' s 50 feet wide. If you. had. a parcel in
Goose Creek that's perhaps 2.00 feet. wide.. I could see the 1.5' side
yard set back, but here you wouldn.'t have to go any further seaward.
to get exactly what you want. They' re just looking for a float a
particular way to sit the sailboat, and power boat they have a long
side. I don't. know any, or see anything happening navigational, or .
public safety. But maybe someone else is fine with. that. They' re not
trying to go any further out into the creek., it' s just the width of
the property.. It' s regulated with. the sidelines on that lot..
TRUSTEE, HOLZAPFEL:. Is there anybody else in the public who would like
to speak?
NEIGHBOR TO NORTH:. On. a. positive note, I'm the nei.ghbor' direct:ly to
the. north. I don't see any problem as. far as I'm concerned with the
boat being extended. It' s not in the: way of my boat, and I don't.
anticipate any problems. in the future.. I had spoke to MR.. King about
that..
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL: That. was a concern that. we had when- we looked at
the. . .I.s. there anybody els.e. that wants to speak either way? That was.
a. concern that, we have the policy that there.' s. sidelines_ and that
obviously you.,ve taken the whole length and. gone over that sideline-
It was a concern. upon. encroaching on the waterway of the-
n eighbor, not being able to get. hi.s dock or boat or. whatever..
Board of Trustees: 10 'ebruary 19, 1997
MR. JUST: Supposedly it wouldn' t project past the projected property
line. But being closer to the adjacent dock might be a little more
difficult. -
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.:. Right.. In general we'd like to see that. 10' .
MR. JUST: I agree, but. this. is the first time I. rea.11y thought on
this thing, where we had to know alot.
TRUSTEE KING: Your on the north side of him?
NEIGHBOR.: I'm on the. north. si.de.
TRUSTEE KING: What's on the south of you?
NEIGHBOR: A bunch of summer cottages.
TRUSTEE KING: No docks though?
NEIGHBOR: No.
TRUSTEE KING: There are remains. of a dock there:. I think. they had. a.
float out this_ past- year. They didn' t before:. The. float. would be too
close to the cottages.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Do you know the . . .
TRUSTEF_ KING.: It' s all narrow, it' s. a 50 foot lot.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: They're all 50 foot?
TRUSTER KING: Around that corner. there, they' re .all in very long
lots, down off the hill.
TRUSTEE" HOLZAPFEL:. Just our immediate reaction is. if that property
isn' t built on, we'd like to stay in. on that side.
MR. JUST: The other side is Sebastian's Cove, that' s all DEC owned-
titled wetlands. There would never be any chance of any docks on that:
side. what so ever. With any interference on the east side of the.
creek there.. Just the two, of the. adjacent neighbors..
TRUSTEK HOLZAPFEL.: I think what were trying- to say is. that 401 is.
probably too much for a 50' piece of property though.
MR. JUST: Well. that.' s what. were here to discuss-
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Right. If we could shorten it up a little bit in
that sense. And the other question, let me back up a little.. The
other question we had. is the: 1.0 x. 2.0. By enlarge. it' s 6 x 20, because:
of shading and coverage and all. that stuff:. I know they already have.
one 10 x: 20, but the. 6 x. 2.0 is more. consistent with what. we've done
through out all the towns:...
MR. JUST: I think 30 would be a good compromise don't you. It gives:
you 10' on the sides. It' s a. 28' boat, it' s easy to tie 40' boat to a
30' float.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I think we still have to maintain that 151 , is it
15' ? Certainly on the one side, where there' s nothing there now.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL: Say that again Glenn,. I'm sorry.
MR. JUST: That' s a policy, I don' t know if that' s the law in. th.e
trustee's.
TRUSTEE- HOLZAPFEL.: Yeah that' s one. of our policies that'.& written up.
MR. JUST: Same thing with the army Corp:. The army meets circumstances-
that are shaped like this:.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL: But it seems'_ to be:, from what Jim said, that
they're a11. 50' frontage. That' s why we have some concern about the:
other neighbor, they wouldn't have that same distance:.
MR.. JUST: Well his right now, when we looked at it, his theoretical.
dock that used. to be there is right on my property, as it. is: My
neighbor adjacent to me already has. a 10. x 40' boat, and i.t. has the.
same property width I have.. The property are staggered, there`s
probably 40' of water between the docks: that' s actually constructed.
Again I. don't know if the full board- has. made an inspection on this-
unique- s-i-tuati-on..
Board of Trustees 11 :bruary 19, 1997
TRUSTEE KI.NG.: Maybe the whole board shoul.d. look at it.
TRUSTEE. WENCZEL: Yeah maybe we_ should...
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Is there any time requirement on this:. in terms:
of. . .
MR. JUST: I_t doesn' t look. like it..
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: than with the idea.. of the .next door neighbor, is
willing to say that he doesn't have a: problem on one side, it might-
be wise- for the. entire board to go down and look at it.. We' ll put it
on the field inspections next month, and, carry the hearing over.
Just for the record,, put, it that. the. CA.0 wanted. the dock to extend,
no further than- the dock. to the north. But it's already there, the
cat walk be elevated 3' above grade.
MR. JUST: The existing one is- 3 1/2 and 3 1/4. We had. the special DEC
roller out today.. It will be elevated 3.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: And they said that the new float not encroach. into
the neighbors navigation and etc. So we' ll look at next month as a
full board..
MR. JUST: That' s fine. Thank You.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: With the idea.- that. we have some questions. o.k.
I.' 11 make a, motion that. we table- this: hearing.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE. HOLZAPEEL. and_ seconded by TRUSTEE
WENCZEL. to table this application. till the next field., inspection
3/18/97. ALL. AYES..
8. JOHN GEIDEMEN on behalf of JOSEPH CASTELLI: requests a
Wetland Permit to construct. a. 13.0' bulkhead. within 18" of old.
bulkhead and in. front. of existing slip, then. frill. in slip with
approx. 50 c.y. of fill., also. a 3' X 24' dock. Located Wells Road-,
Peconic. SCTM.# a6-2-10..
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL:. Is there anybody in the public: that wishes to
speak about this .issue? It was tabled from last month. Anybody on the.
board. have any comments:.. Our one concern was moving- out IV but we've
done it every where else.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: Well didn't we have a concern with eliminating that
jog, and continuing on the, other side. there, on the west side I guess
it was. Going diagonally across. I know Mr.. Tuthill objected.
strenuously to it.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL.: Your not opening up trouble when you. angle it. In.
that sense. It provides an angle to the next door neighbors property
more so.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL: I think. it would.. give the entire martial- to
recolonize the area.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.: We could equally say that we want to replant. You
know, grade and replant. in front. of the bulkhead. An area equal, to.
what was lost:. That would. accomplish, bas:ical.ly the same.. thing.
TRUSTEE' WENCZEL: Well they have what' s there -I wouldn.'t. be surprised..
if that structure wasn't causing some of the erosion on the other
side there. On. the west side there, the way it juts out and there' s a
fairly opened. reach right there.
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL. Any other comments.? We haven't had...a meeting this,
easy all year. Peter I think we can accomplish. it by asking to.. ..
TRUSTEE. WENCZEL': Replant in front. of the bulkhead.. Fine.
TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL.: That way the area that's, being- filled., will_ be at.
l.eas.t. reclaimed..
CLERK: In front of the entire bulkhead., or just a section?
Board of. Trustees. 12 ebruary 19, 1997
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: Well just a section, how big is. the. area. that' s
been- closed off?
TRUSTEE WENCZEL.: I'm not saying that. that' s. an important probl.em. in
that little slope there. I'm just looking at the other side,. what' s
happening. Don't misunderstand. I can' t even find the scale over
here.. You can't even read it that' s what it is. Somebody have. a.
better copy of. this.?
CLERK: 1" equals 40. That' s what the old. plan was, and they just_
added the dock under the new plan. so it sho-uld be. the. same.. I.t' s. up
by the north. arrow.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL.: Well it looks. like it' s 15' across and 20' deep.
300 sq. feet
CLERK: How long is. the property?
TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL: 130 is the straight. part, but now it's been.
straightened out. Does the. CAC have any comments. on this? o.k.
Peter you. want to make. a motion.
TRUSTEE WENCZEL.: No you can make the motion.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE. GARRELL. and. seconded bt TRUSTEE.
WENCZEL to close this hearing.. ALL AYES..
A- motion was made by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL and- seconded by TRUSTEE
GARRELL to approve the applicati.on. with. the area 3 x 1.00' being
graded. and planted:., with. Sparti.na planted in front of the bulkhead.,.
replace bottom that is being lost.. ALL. AYES..
RESOLUTIONS:
1. Costello Marine on behalf. of DOROTHY THOET requests. a
Grandfather Permit to reconstruct 501 , 54' , and 60' jetties and 125'
timber bulkhead. built. prior to 1.94.5.. Located. 3a0 Peconic Bay Blvd.. ,
Laurel. SCTM #k1.45-2-3.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE. KING and seconded by TRUSTEE HOLZAPFEL
to approve this. application but not- to. extend further. than LWM. as.
per. drawing. ALL AYES..
VI . MOORINGS:
1. BOB GAMMON requests a duck blind permit in Richmond Creek.
A motion was made by TRUSTEE ROLZAPFEL and seconded. by TRUSTER
WENCZEL to table this application till August. ALL AYES.
2. CHARLES GREENE. requests approval. to place 10 wave abatement.
floats over town. property in front of Albertson's Marine: as per
application.
A motion was. made. by TRUSTEE. HOLZAPFEL_ a.nd seconded. by TRUSTEE: KING.
to keep temporary approval. of the 4 wave abatement. floats., until the:
board can review the full application at it' s March 2.6, 1997 regular
meeting. - �`."`_ "'_.-- -.-
77
MEETING ADJOURNED BY: 8:3.0 P.M.
WORKSESS.I:ON. ADJOURNED BY: 10:3 0 P.M.
;SETOTAM
.CTFU LY SUBMITTED.. BY: � �°
ill .M. Doherty, Jerk