HomeMy WebLinkAboutTB-04/22/1980 SOUTHOLD TOWN BOARD
April 22 , 1980
EXECUTIVE SESSION
10 : 00 A.K. - The Town Board met in Exeuctive Session to discuss
personnel matters .
WORK SESSION
Deputy Supervisor Johnson reported on her meeting with the Suffolk
County Development Corporation. She will invite Elaine Weiss of
the SCDA to come to a Town Board work session and explain their
program.
Councilman Murdock will report at the regular meeting on Peconic
County Day in Albany. Supervisor Pell stated he and Supervisor
Lang of Southampton met with all those senators and assemblymen
in opposition to Peconic County. They were very well received.
Supervisor Pell will report at the regular meeting on ,his trip
to Albany relative .to gasoline allocations . He met with Congress-
man Carney, Senators Javits _ and Moynihan and members of the Department
of Energy and he was assued by Senator Javits the East End would
not be hit hard again this year . The matter of decentralization and
decontroll arose and Councilman Nickles suggested that the Board
support the positions of Congressman Carney and Downey on this.
Supervisor Pell will obtain a copy of the bill .
Supervisor Pell reported that at the last meeting of the ten town
supervisors they agreed unanimously to ask to have the Suffolk
County Legislature abolished and return to the regular. Board of
Supervisors .
Councilman Drum will report on the Inland Waterways Committee at
the regular meeting. He hopes to get .,-the committee together next
week to again look at all of the inland waterways .
Councilman Drum reported on his meeting with Merlon Wiggin relative
to civil preparedness.
The Board reviewed each item on the agenda for the regular meeting.
Mrs . Martha J. Paul spoke to the Board relative to the preservation
of Robins Island and acquisition by the County of Suffolk. ---Mr . Frank.
Bear stated the adoption by the Town Board of Supervisor .Pell ' s
resolution as presented at the April 8th meeting is the first step
toward acquisition.---The Board discussed Supervisor,. Pell ' s resolution.
Supervisor Pell and Highway- Superintendent Dean recommended hiring
Holzmacher, McLendon and Murrell to prepare the engineering surveys
for the highway safety improvement program. They will meet with
representatives of H2M to go over a priority list .
Councilman Murdock spoke about a rat newspaper article quoting
a town official who wished to remain unnamed. Councilman Murdock
feels all town officials should expect their identity to be revealed
in the press .
Discussion was held relative to dredging in the New Suffolk ramp. I't
was learned the County dredge is still being repaired and will not
be available until at least May 1st . Councilman Drum recommended
that the Town go ahead and hire someone to do the dredging and then
bill the County. Highway Superintendent Dean estimates the cost
would be approximately $300. per day. Town Attorney Tasker said
that it would have to be done at Town expense as there is no guarantee
the County will pay the bill . At present there is only $800. in the
budget for dredging.
3 : 00 P .M. - Building Inspector George Fisher met w th. the Board to
discuss yard sale permits . Mr. Fisher was advised- he should handle
each case on its own merits, taking into consideration whether the-
yard sale is a normal accessory use or a pre-existing non-conforming
use .
APRIL 22, 1980 623-
3 : 30 P.M. the Town Board held a public hearing on proposed local
liw entitled "Local Law to Provide for the Appointment of Committees" .
A regular meeting of the Southold Town Board was held on Tuesday,
April 22, 1980 at the Southold Town Hall , Main Road, Southold, New
York. Supervisor Pell opened the meeting at 7 : 30 P.M. with the
Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.
Present :
Supervisor William R. Pell :TTI
Councilman Henry W. Drum
Councilman John J. Nickles
Councilman Lawrence Murdock, Jr.
Councilman George R. Sullivan
Town Clerk Judith T. Terry
Town Attorney Robert W. Tasker
Deputy Supervisor Marie Bauer Johnson
Absent : Justice Francis T. Doyen
On motion of Councilman Drum, seconded by Councilman- Murdock, it was
RESOLVED that- the minutes of the regular meeting of the Southold Town
Board held on April 8, 1980 be and hereby are approved. .
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman:,_Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
On motion of Councilman Nickles, seconded by Councilman Drum,. it was
RESOLVED that the next regular meeting of the Southold Town Board
will be held at 7: 30 P.M. , Tuesday, May 6, 1980 at the Southold Town
Hall, Main Road, Southold, New York.
Vote of the Town Board : Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman NIckles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution .was declared duly adopted.
REPORTS
1. Receipt of March 1980 report of Justice James H. Rich, Jr .
2 . DEPUTY SUPERVISOR MARIE BAUER JOHNSON: This has to do with
the Suffolk County Development Corporation which has two programs
that Southold Town has been invited to take part in. I am afraid
we have already lost out on one, -the expiration for applying was two
weeks ago and we had an extension until today. Since we haven 't taken
the proper action we. probably will not be able to take part in it .
This was the rent subsidy program for people with limited income
and housing problems . The other is a winteration project which
we have until the second week of May to get involved with and I
believe the Town Board' s action this morning was to decide to ask
the head of the corporation to come down either to give, them more
information about it and possibly with that we will have some action
in that program. This would provide for insulation and storm windows,
weather stripping, that sort of thing or other projects that concern
energy.
3 . Receipt of the March 1980 report from Long Island Cablevision
Corp.
4 . Receipt of the March 1980 report from the Town Trustees . On
their filing and permit applications . It is that time of the year
there are 24 permits that were required in the last month; the time
of year that everybody goes to the waterfront .
5 . Receipt of the March 1980 Dog Warden report .
6 . COUNCILMAN LAWRENCE MURDOCK, JR. : A week ago Monday we had six
bus loads go to Albany and I felt the reception was excellent . We
packed the floor of the Assembly, we packed the gallery of the Assembly
and when Assemblyman Behan introduced the Southampton Militia, which
they renamed the Peconic Militia for the day, while I 'm a novice at
the Assembly I was very impressed that all the Assemblyman stood up
and gave them a rising cheer . The elected officials spent the rest
of the day seeing Assemblyman Fink who is the Majority Leader and
who at all previous times had resisted contact by the Peconic County
group, and Senator Anderson 's office, which at all previous times had
resisted the group and we also addressed a Republican Committee in
64 APRIL 22 , 1980
charge of , I think it was the Home Rule Committee . They were in
session and they asked us to address them. Then we had a cocktail
party in the evening and it was very well attended. Even Senator
Anderson came himself . The effect of the day I think was excellent ,
the people were in a good mood, the legislators up there all seemed
to be friendly and receptive and from the people at the west end and
upstate said, "Well if it isn ' t going to cost us any money anyway
why should we oppose you" . I think it was a real good day . I 'm not
sure if we cleared all the hurdles, 'I don 't really think we have as
yet but it was areal big step forward for that day.
7 . SUPERVISOR WILLIAM R. PELL III : - This past Wednesday I went down
to Washington, D.C. Our County Executive who had done a superb job
represnting the five east end towns arranged a meeting *in Washington.
D.C. in regards to gasoline. I never thought in one day that I
personally would be in a congressman ' s office and two New York State
Senator 's Office . Our County Exec. Peter Cohalan arranged for us to "
meet with the Department of Energy. people in the senator ' s office and
on behalf of the east end, or as he said, half of Suffolk:-County, plead
our case for gasoline for the summer months . Plead a restriction that
was brought up about no weekend boating in the summer months for
recreational purposes. Last year one supervisor from the east end
towns went down there all along and plead the case on gasoline . Along
she said she didn 't . get in the front door, but through our County
Executive who arranged the meeting for us we spend 45._.minutes with
Senator Javits and equal time with Senator Moynihan and Department of
Energy people. We were assured by our senators that the Department
of Energy would be coming forth with a new allocation system for
gasoline for the northeast and particularly Long Island' s east end.
this is supposed to take place within the next three to four weeks .
They have a deadline . The senators want it back in their office
sometime before the end of this month so they can review it before.
it is announced. I think we all owe a gratitude of thanks to our
County Exec . for all the work he did to arrange this . United the
five of us went down with him, with Judith Hop- from the Governor ' s
office and we were assured at this meeting for the first time that
our situation on the east end was unique of the rest of the area
around us, the plans they worked under last year were ineffective
and did not work and they will review them, told to review them by
the senators, and come back with new plans. All of us came home
that night feeling he accomplished something that day. We had a
good day .
8 . SUPERVISOR PELL: Number 8 took place last Thursday up in
Oakdale. Ten Supervisors of Suffolk ,County met for the first time
all ten of us was . there, before it was always seven, six, nine, never
had ten, this time we had ten there . We discussed in detail the
abolishment of the Suffolk county Legislature; to replace it with
what is known as a Board of Supervisors . We unanimously, the ten of
us, went on record in this direction. In the ten towns probably
starting tomorrow there will be petitions circulating asking the
people to endorse this concept .: They have volunteers throughout the
towns , I don ' t know who the volunteers are in the different towns .
They have volunteers who are going to handle this petition drive .
If youiread about it in the press I am sure you will be reading
more about it .
9. COUNCILMAN HENRY W.. DRUM: Very briefly, Inland -Waterways
Committee . The county has indicated that they would dredge some of
our inlets in the Bay, one in particular which is closed at present
is of greatest concern to us and that ' s the New Suffolk ramp where
we launch our police boat , emergency boat for- any emergency, but also
it is used for our people for pleasure, fishing, what have you. It is
closed. Unfortunately the dredge is under repair and I am not sure
when it is .going to be ready, although it was promised to us by the
county that it would be completed, the dredging would be completed by
the 15th of April . . We may be forced to do it ourselves with town
funds, this is the way .it appears at present . I think this it thw v
only way to go right now, Of course,we have other projects as ' well
that need dredging. The Mattituck Inlet , this is a Corps df
Engineer project and they had purchased a dredge, they are a Massachusetts
company. Again this was going to have commenced on the 15th of April,
they haven ' t started yet , however they indicate it will be completed
by the l'st of May. I can ' t say it is exactly good news.
10 . COUNCILMAN DRUM: Our Emergency Readiness Plan and our Civil
Defense, they call it , well it ,is no longer Civil Defense, it is really
Civil Preparedness. As I am sure you are aware, we are in an area
-where there is a nuclear plant in Connecticut that we also have
proximity to and a nuclear submarine base in New London. Some of the
towns have a plan and I might say we are going to work on a plan. The
APRIL 22, 1980
county has provided the services of an individual for three weeks and
he and I are going to commence working on the plan. The persons name
i- Merlon Wiggin from Orient . This will require coordination of our
fire departments, police department as well and we are going to work
on this . ---It--' is interesting to note, I may have mentioned this before
that Mr. Wiggin is going to Albany and taking one of the career
development and . preparedness course, he went into their civil preparedness
room, emergency room, and he looked upon the map of New York State and
low and behold Fishers Island is missing from New York State . Needless
to say we are a little concerned and they assured us that we would be
, given more consideration from here on out .'
.11 . SUPERVISOR PELL: This is the kind of report I am very
pleased and proud to make today. I asked our Chief of Police to make
sure he was here tonight and he is here somewhere. The last two weeks
out town police department• has done one heck of a job. The Town Board
discussed it today in great length, the Police Committee did and then
the full Town Board and they want to compliment the Chief and his
entire staff for the fine job they ahve done working with the volunteer
firemen. The last two weeks some of the incidents that we had occur
in this Town. ---I 'm passing praise on to the Chief and I hope he will
pass it` on to his department men and to the firemen of our town who
worked at this . Within the last two weeks we had--we -lost a life
in Laurel through a drowning, the. police and firemen worked to recover
the body; we had two bodies come up we lost last fall, duck hunters,
again the police and firemen have worked together, involvement . We
had an auto death a few days ago in Southold, again the police and
firemen cut the car apart to get the young man out . It is the spirit
they work in. .They had a break-in in Mattituck. They caught the
person and got most of the merchandise back. The last two weeks our
police have done one heck of a job. Yes, they are payed for it , but
yes it 's still their job to do it and when you do something they do
it . The Town Board- like publicly to thank them for it and thank
them for working with the firemen and the firemen for working with
our police department . The unit that this Town Board is proud of .
Chief, I see you standing in the back of the room, we thank you and
we hope you pass it on to your men.
PUBLIC NOTICES
COUNCILMAN JOHN J. NICKLES :
1 . Application before the Department of the Army, New York
District , Corps of Engineers, an application by Henry Pierce to
construct a catwalk and floating pier . This work will occur at
Richmond Creek and you have 20 days to make any comments and the
date of the letter is April 4th, so that will be on the 24th.
2 . Another application involving Sterling Basin, it is also
Mr . Pierce at his yacht basin where he plans to expand the marina
and maintenance dredge . The response date for that to the Corps
of Engineers is May 3rd. Copies of these plans and applications
are in the Town Clerk's Office if you wish to review them.
COMMUNICATIONS
SUPERVISOR PELL':
1. Request for a street light , turned over to the Street Light
Committee . (Custodio Brandi , Moores Lane North, Greenport . )
2 . Request- for - a.:s;treet' light, turned over to. .the ,Street Light
Committee.: (Jody .Adams, Indian. Neck_ Lane . Peconic.. ).:- .Councilman Drum
is that committee, committee of one, the only- thingyouu. need is
some street lights_,- - _117e are. -all - out. of st~roei ' lights we. have-got- to
authorize the..purch_ ase.
3 , This: will appear later on under resolut .ons�. Basically
the supervisorsof the west end towns are very supportive of the
bottle, litter, trash ordinance bill . Senator LaValle and Assemblyman
Behan have sponsored a bill in this regard. Later on the Town Board
will pass a resolution to .support the same bill on this . This is the
thrid or fourth time we have been asked to go along. with. this and
the five east end towns all are presenting it to their town boards
the next time they meet . Today our Town Board decided to go along
with the- request .
4 . Request for financial support from the Mattituck Women `s
Softball League which we did support them last year and the Board
is going to look favorably on it this year .
5 . A meeting on April 24th at 1 : 00 P.M. in Hauppauge with
Legislator Noto to discuss Peconic County . The five east end
supervisors will be there . It is an open .meeting, anybody interested
can come, come on up, Hauppauge, 1 : 00 P.M.
66, APRIL 22 , 1980
6 . This is called a U.N. Day that- is going to be held October
24th. The Town Board has been asked to appoint someone to sort of
coordinate affairs of- this they might want to do in Southold Town.
Since we have on the Board a 30 year .Navy man, today I will appoint
Captain-Councilman Drum to serve in this capacity .
7. A letter about dredging Brushes Creek. Councilman Drum
who is in charge of the Waterways has a reply ready to be sent back
to the gentlemen . (Mr . Bertram Walker., Peconic Bay Blvd. , Laurel . )
8 . a. & b. Letters pro and opposed to Robins Island acquisiton.
9. A request for payment by Bartra Electric. It has been sent
to the architect who worked_ on .the addition to the Town Hall . We got
it in the other day and we sent it to them to look into, as to what it
is all about and report back to the Board.
10 . Copy of the resolution which they (Riverhead Town) passed
on home rule of Peconic County. I got a telephone call from John�.f..
Behan last night at half past six and one today around a quarter after
eight from somebody else up there (Albany) saying don 't act on the
bill . There is `a misprint in it , it is going to have to be -reprinted
in order to act on it , so we crossed it off of our resolution sheet .
Southampton Town Board meets today and the Southold Town Board so they
stopped '.'the two of us, the towns didn 't pass it .
11. This item doesn ' t belong there any way. (DEC notice re :
property outside of Southold Township. )
HEARINGS AND DECISIONS
SUPERVISOR PELL:
1 . Richard A. Schlumpf hearing . to be held May 6th:-at 8 : 10 P.M.
for a catwalk and floating dock (wetland application) .
2 . Maidstone Development Corp. , a hearing from "A" Residential
and Agricultural to "M-1", that hearing will be held on May 6th at 8 : 15 P.M.
(change of zone application)
3 . Wayne Associates, a hearing from "A" Residential and Agricult-
ural to "M-1" that hearing will be held on May 6th at 8': 30 P.M. (change
Of zone application)
RESOLUTIONS
1 . SUPERVISOR PELL: Item No . 1 under resolutions is a resolution I
proposed to the Town Board the last time it met . I will redo it
this time and ask my deputy to read it and I will offer it in
resolution form:
DEPUTY SUPERVISOR JOHNSON:
RESOLUTION: County Acquisition of Robins Island, Town of Southold.
Resolution made by William R. Pell III, Supervisor .
WHEREAS, Robins Island, a 400+ acre natural Island in the Town of
Southold, is a unique natural area, and
WHEREAS, it has been recommended for preservation by the Suffolk
County Planning Commission since 1960, and
WHEREAS, several recent proposals have discussed the public acquisiton
of Robins Island, and
WHEREAS, this Island is of prime concern to the Government and people
of the Town of Southold, and
WHEREAS, the proper disposition, management , and use of this Island
could be of great economic and environmental benefit to the Town of
Southold, Now Be It Therefore
RESOLVED, that "-.the Town Board of Southold wishes to go on record
by adopting this home rule resolution, that it is in favor of the
protection and preservation of this important piece of Southold
real estate, and Be It Further
RESOLVED, that the Town Board of the Town of Southold wishes to
inform the County Executive, the Legislature, and Legislator Blass,
of the Town ' s support for the County acquisition of Robins Island,
if it be in accord with the following:
1 . That the Island be acquired by the County of Suffolk
under the provisions of the Nature Trust of the Suffolk
County Charter to insure that the Island will remain a
preservation area in perpetuity and not at any time
developed for intensive park purposes.
2 . That the County assign adequate ranger control to insure
the safe monitoring of the Island, and that the ranger
control be under the Town jurisdiction.
3 . That the management policies be assigned to the Town of
Southold so that the effective control of the Island be
at Town level in order to protect the interests of the
people of the Town' -- a policy that already is in existence
whereby County Park properties such as the County holdings
at Shinnecock in the' Town of Southampton, are managed by
APRIL 22, 1980
6"
the municipality rather than the. County.
4 . That the County phase out the tax burden to the New Suffolk
school district and the Town of Southold by including
within the acquisition a twenty- year tax phase out program
that would reduce the contribution to the district and Town
by five percent each year during the twenty year period.
Supervisor Pell offered the foregoing resolution, Councilman Nickles
seconded the motion. Supervisor Pell opened the floor for discussion.
COUNCILMAN MURDOCK: Bill, I ' ll start with my part of the discussion
as we discussed in the work session this morning. I asked then and
I will ask you again, is it understood by you that the Town of Southold
is not in a financial position to undertake this project by ourselves
nor to underwrite it if any part of this proposal is not accepted.
The. part where to safeguard the island if the County doesn 't assign
the rangers and it would probably cost six men between rotations and
days off, probably be a cost of $150, 000 a year just' to maintain
protection. I have, as I said this morning, serious doubts that (a)
nobody has offered money to acquire the island, and (b) baring anybody
offering the money to acquire the island it doesn't see a proper
vehicle for an elected official to just make a motion or suggestion
that has no chance, in fact , or being done. You agreed this morning
that the Town does not have the money and you did not propose.:.that
the Town underwrite this program.
SUPERVISOR PELL: Larry, you're right , we went through this this
morning. I do not , as fiscal officer of the Town, I do not see where
the Town could underwrite this unless we on the Town level , as the
County Exeuctive has said, he will go for whatever the Town wishes.
as we know in his open space program he did recommend the county
acquisition of Robins Island. We on the town level would have to
in my reading of the thing,. would have to make the first step to ask
the County Executive if he has money for it in his open space program,
would he have the same money available to sponsor a resolution like
this I put forth. Next question .
COUNCILMAN SULLIVAN: I have some questions . First it is my belief
that the majority of the Southold Town residents are not in favor of
county acquisition. Number two it has come down to somewhat of partisan
issue of Republican versus Democratic as far as governing control vis-a-
vis private ownership. My feeling is that this kind of highlights the
situation in our country that led to government control, too much
government control . We are in a situation now, I think our whole
country is in a situation - let the government do it . I think this
is wrong. I don':t think we should be looking towards them. I have
some problems with the objectivity of sponsors of the resolution. In
the sense of their accusations of financial benefit to members of the
Town Board, this has been voiced to me several times, I think that ' s
absolutely one hundred percent wrong. The next thing I would like to
bring up is that the Supervisor is not aware of the contents of his
resolution, since I questioned him this afternoon on the contents or
understanding of a Nature Trust . I myself do not know what that is,
nor did he. I am opposed to the land being taken off the tax rolls
at this particular time, in times of economic hardship, and I question
the legality of the county compensating the New Suffolk school district
for school taxes. It is also my understanding that by referendum the
nature trust concept could be abrogated. These are my questions on
this specific proposal that has been brought up.
SUPERVISOR PELL: Questions or statements, George?
COUNCILMAN SULLIVAN: Either, or .
SUPERVISOR PELL: Mostly statements I would say .
COUNCILMAN DRUM: I ' ll make a statement alter the people have had a
chance to speak.
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : I ' ll wait until the people speak.
MARTHA J. PAUL, Cutchogue: I am giving the Board some more petitions .
he top one i.a from th.e Nassau Farms Association, Mr , Henry Freeman,
President , and this area compromises some one hundred families. ---
Today is Earth Day. Tt will be celebrated .acros�s the nation as it has
been for the past ten years to acknowledge that we, as- human beings,
can no longer afford to misuse, abuse and exploit our environment and
APRIL 22, 1980
survive on this planet . It was proclaimed to make us-:all more aware
of the land, air and water which sustain us . Right now, at this moment ,
Southold Town is faced with a very serious water problem. Temik and
nitrate levels in drinking water are dangerously high. The air we
breathe - is threatened by contamination from the proposed coal burning
LILCO plant at Jamesport , the Shoreham nuclear plant and the nuclear
power plant in operation now at Millstone, Connecticut , within a ten
mile radius of this Town. To the east a disaster at Plum Island could
be reality. Our creeks and bays have not escaped pollution. Where
have all the fish gone? Fish will not stay in contaminated waters .
Land preservation- is no longer an option in this Town. It is necess-
ary- for survival . And not only in this Town but this nation and this
world. In order for this world .to survive it has to atart right here
at the local level . This Board is not the first that has had to
decide whether to allow development of land or not but they will be
the last Board to decide whether to allow development of the last
remaining uninhadited island of this size, some of it untouched since
glacial times in the entire .State of New York. Over two thousand
years ago a proverb was written. Some scholars say that King Solomon
wrote it, and it says, "Where there is no vision the people perish" .
It ' s as true now as it was then. Men of vision down through the
centuries in all nations have set aside land to remain undeveloped
forever . Out County Executive Cohalan has offered to acquire Robins
Island. Our County Legislator; Blass has spoken out for county
acquisition. In order to preserve this special island our Supervisor
has proposed..a resolution to that effect and enough people in the
Town have signed the petitions . We now have 2434 signatures to
mandate its acquisiton:. It is right to preserve this island, it is
wrong to develop it and the choice is up to the Town Board. Thank you.
DOUG SHAW, Mattituck: I will start by saying I strongly support the
preservation of .Robins Island in its natural state . The reasons which
prompted me to take this stand are numerous. Economic, political,
ecological, aesthetic, recreational, but most of all moral . The people
who are making decisions about what happens to Robins Island are_
considerably older than I , and won't have to live with the consequences
of their decisions for. the half century or so that I will . But more
important than my petty concerns are those of our children, likewise:
our grandchildren and their children who are going to have to live
with this decision all of their lives because if our leaders chose
development for Robins Island it ' s a one shot choice, there ' s no
going back if the land is ripped apart . Most of us know what ' s been ,
proposed for Robins Island by its current owners . Twenty-eighthouses
on 242 acres, 118 acres in the middle of the island and 80 acres in
several other areas left undeveloped by private government . Also
proposed is a heliport on the island and ferry slips on the island
and in New Suffolk. All of this sounds pretty dramatic and exciting
until you consider who stands to gain what and what is being lost .
The gainers are the backers of the Southold Development Corporation
represented to us only by Mr. William esseks who ' s titled their
President , but who in fact is only their lawyer . None of the principals
have seen fit to identify themselves. Itis pretty standard these
days among the very wealthy in Europe and the Middle East . It makes
is easy for them to dodge responsibility for their actions and for
their mistakes . Even with the best conceived plan for a development ,
all of the confusion about who we are dealing with ought to give our
councilmen for pause in their enthusiam for development . We don ' t
know who we are dealing with whether or we can trust them to live
up to their promises . Hamburg, West Germany is a long way from here
and nothing is on paper yet and in the time between proposals and
bulldozers promises can evaporate into this air . So what,. anyway, does
this proposal mean? Well, I 'm told the lots will sell for about
$200, 000 apiece so you and I won 't be running out to buy one next
week. Who will? Some pretty rich people. So Robins Island which
has deeded rights running out under the water so we mere peasants,who
can 't so much as stroll along the beach, will become an exclusive
retreat for a few, a very few, very wealthy people who are trying to
escape the real world while the rest of us are forced to stay. So the
gainers are 28 people who can plunk down the half million or so
necessary for the land and a suitable house to go on, also the
mysterious owners of the Southold Development Corporation. The rest
of us are the losers: We ' re the ones who can ' t jet off to the
Bahamaw when the mood strikes us.. We have' to stay where we are and
list with what we 've got . Now, private real property does have
rights according to .a little booklet which appeared in the bank the
other day published by the National Association of Realtors . Those
APRIL 22, 1980
rights are to use, to sell.,. to ,.lease, ro enter, to give, or the right
to refuse or exercise any of these rights. But the booklet goes on to
say that these rights are limited by several powers of government . Taxation
which support local government , eminent domain which allows government
to take property in the public_ interest upon payment of just compensation
and finally police power:,., This is the right of government to regulate
property for the protection of the public safety, ' health, morals and
general welfare. Zoning codes, housing codes , and subdivision controls
are examples of regulations that are based on .this power . None of us here
tonight is interested in taking anything away from anyone without just
compensation, even from wealthy foreigners. But there aren 't many of
us who want to see the last piece of wilderness in Southold Town
chopped up to satisfy the developers greed. We don ' t have to permit
that and if we are smart we won ' t . As wilderness, Robins Island doesn 't
cost us much. Fire and police protection aren 't much in demand among
birds and deer, neither are schools, roads or sanitation . Houses and
people, on the other hand, require all of that and we can rest assured
that any future residents of Robins Island are going to demand something
1 return for the taxes on their half million dollar estates no.;.zhatber what
de
evelopers promise on their behalf. before the fact , and that ' s only
fair. Now, public acquisition of Robins Island would diminish tax
receipts by $39, 800: at .current rate. Of special concern is the New Suffolk
School District which receives $24, 000 of that amount . But Supervisor Pell ' s
proposal to acquire the island has specified that funds be provided on a
declining basis of over twenty years to cover that cost . Under that program
the average district taxpayers bill would increase by a whopping $3 . 72
a year or something ridiculous like 31 cents a month. That 's no burden
to any of us. Why do we need to save Robins Island. First , it ' s one
of the last bits of our national heritage left in these parts . It
came to us in one piece and like the family jewels it ' s up to us,-to
pass it. on to posterity in good condition. There have to be such
places on the face of the earth where ordinary working people and
not just the wealthy can go to find peace and quiet , serenity and
beauty and there. are some solid 'economic reasons too . Tourism, for
example, is one of our biggest industries, that requires tourists.
What attracts people to eastern Long Island? Its natural beauty .
People don 't want to see helicopters taking off and landing and
ferries going back and forth. They can see that any day of the week
in Manhattan. They come to see Osprey and Terns floating on the wind.
Wood and running Deer . Clean water and clean air, unspoiled beaches .
That 's what keeps a lot of us in business . A lot of us own hotels or
rental property or :marinas or shops that do a lot of business with
summer people, and some people seem to think that they stand to make
some sort of profit from this proposed development . But as John
NicklesL_said to me the other evening, this thing is , too big and.
exotic for local business to manage. In the case of his business
which is real estate, it being the sort of thing that Southerby-
Park-Burnett would handle, but not him. And that ' s no bad reflection
on any of us, we are just geared to normal business with normal
people so likely none of us will profit from this development . But
even if we did, those profits would be gone in five years and so
would Robins Island. That leaves us with nothing,, no money, no
island. So there are some very good reasons to preserve Robins
Island. Our obligation to ourselves adn future generations heads
the list . But the fact that we don ' t know who we are dealing .with
when we talk to the developer 's lawyer, and the fact that from the
point- of view of taxes and our own tourist economy we could 'easily
cut our financial throats. . All of these things point to preservation.
Adn we 've only. got one chance left . The time to save Robins Island,
the last time to save Robins Island, is now and that ' s your job,
gentlemen. . Thank you very much.
SUPERVISOR PELL: I 'm going to have to ask any further speakers to
keep it a little bit shorter, I don 't want to have the Board- spend
the night here . We like to hear you. talk, this is a very important
issue to all of us.
JOSEPH SAWICKI , Jr. , , Southold: Supervisor Pell, Councilman of the
Southold Town Board and ladies and gentlemen in the audience . My
name is Joseph Sawicki, Jr . and I reside on the North Road . in Southold
and I thank you for the privilege of being able to speak before you
this evening concerning the future of Robins Island. As a lifelong
resident of Southold it is my belief that Robins Island be allowed
limited private development . As representatives of Southold ' s
residents .it is the duty of the Town Board to insure the continuation
of conservative fiscal government, as well as, especially in this day
70 APRIL 22, 1980
and age of Proposition 13 , to keep property taxes down as low as
possible. As we all know, private development of Robins Island would
mean a larger tax base for the Town, which, of course, results in
lower property taxes for the town residents. To continue to condemn,
sterlize and confiscate property in taking land off the tax rolls
is not the answer to Southold Town ' s future . Our country, the richest
and most affluent nation in the world has developed through the
capitalistic system and this should continue to prevail . Two years
ago before .I was fortunate enough to be gainfully employed in the
Suffolk County Comptroller,' s Office it was necessary for me to live
and work in Nassau County, away from my home in Southold in order to
obtain employment which followed my college education. Even today
it is necessary for me to travel to Hauppauge on- a daily basis. This
private development will affect the economy of the Town and east end
of the island to allow more jobs and to a certain point stimulate
our sagging economy. I also wholeheartedly feel that it is the
responsibility of town, county, -and state legislators to maintain the
unique rural character of Eastern Long Island as it now stands and
through limited development and proper planning this environment that
we all ch r.ish will never be diminished or hurt . The Town Board has
the wherewithall to guarantee this through their zoning procedures
and this must be done for the benefit of our _Town and its taxpayers .
As you know, as Mr. Pell said before, my occupation is that of Deputy
County Comptroller for Suffolk, serving with our County Comptroller
Mr . Joseph Caputo, and I would like to point our at this time that
Mr . Caputo concurs with this position. Thank you.
WILLIAM GOLDER, Southold : All I 'd like to say is I would like to ask
Mr . Sawicki which placed he liked better, whether he liked Suffolk
County out here living or whether he would rather live in Nassau
County . I lived in Nassau County where' I used to shoot birds and
so forth and fish and it was wonderful when I was a kid. Then they
built houses . Right after houses, adn some of those houses are
ripped down, and there is nothing but big places and if you want
to go out for a little fun, why you can walk around the street and
get mugged or something like that . This is, development that is progress
as seen from a money- standpoint . What we are going to be, we are .
going to have the same thing out here. - We can be cement from one
side to the other or we can have our wonderful living as we 've enjoyed
it and our posterity has a right to enjoy it and I 'm very much in favor
of preserving that , just like Gardiners Island- and thank God they
preserved Connetquot . I-f anybody-s ever been' to that park you'd be
surprised what the government can do with. a park and keep it in its
natural condition. It is wonderful there and Robins Island can just
as well be taken .care of . The future is up to ourselves.
SUPERVISOR PELL: I would like all remarks addressed to the chair .
We will have no cross-fire, it will come to the chair up here, please ..
JOHN WICKHAM, Cutchogue :, Ladies and gen.tl:emen.. It is probably there
is no one more directly concerned with. what happens to Robins Island
than myself . MY FAMILY AND I' own about 150 acres in New Suffolk .
School District . I would guess that excluding Robins Island there
is not more than 300 acres. Now, true, a lot of our holdings arel
wetlands but we are certainly the most directly concerned with. what
the tax picture will be . There will be no question of that . It
would appear to me that if Robins Island were developed in as little
as ten years i.t would have a severe affect on. our tax structure. I
think that many of you don 't realize how,much .it costs to maintain
highways on Fishers Island. , This is a responsibility of the Town .
We would presumably have to maintain highways on Robins Island. I
have heard it -said there wouldn ''t be :any children so that they would
be no schools- but I submit that the people who own these homes would
have live-in help and there would be children and I' believe the State
mandates transportation for as little as one child. I have already
heard that the Cutchogue Fj:re. Distr.i.ct would 'expand to, include Robins.
Island and we wonder about, again, twenty-four hour staffing of a
substation or what arrangements could, be made., Frankly, if all of
Robins Island were taken off the tax rolls it is my personal opinion.
that we would be better. off, not immediately, _but in ten to twenty-;�i_ve
years, than to have it developed, Now, there is just one more thing,
and I ' m looki.ng at Bob Tacker now, I understand that we may not engage
.ri contract zoning,. therefore we may not enter into an agreement or a
contract which. 'says- ;th.at there will be four or -eight acre zoning or
there will be only twnety-eight homes . In other words., ladies and
APRIL 22, 19801
gentlemen, we have to face the =fact that the courts may say you have
one acre zoning in the Town of Southold, there will be three hundred
and fifty homes allowed. These are the possibilities . I don ' t know
the answer . I don 't know, as I stand here today, whether the town
gains or loses . I don ' t know whether I gain or lose but somebody
needs to make some very serious studies of just what might happen.
Thank you.
CHUCK MEYER, Southold: I ' ll make my comments very very brief . There
are very few Gardens of Eden left in this world. The eastern
end of Long Isaldn used to be one bastion when I moved out here, it
has diminshed constantly since; the concrete is growing every day
Robins Island is still a Garden of Eden. If you are damed fools
enough to bite on the apple and destroy it you deserve anything you
get and perhaps our children and their grand children after them will
hate you for doing it .
JAMES DILL,New',Suffolk: There are several things . We have waterfront
property that we have had in the family for years. I know John, John
knows me . But there are several things I would like to bring out . One
is, I resent Councilman Sullivan ' s idea that it ' s Republican versus
Democrat . I 'm a long time Republican, a lifelong, and I resent , I
am for the preservation of Robins .Island and politics should not enter
this thing at all .
COUNCILMAN SULLIVAN: Jim, I didn ' t want it to but apparently it has .
MR. DILL: My other point is this, these foreigners with their cheap
dollars have bought this exclusively, no automobiles or anything and
I 'm here to ask not only to preserve Robins Island but what is going
to happen to the town of New, Suffolk with its parking space . At the
present time . ---it ' s all right for people in other parts, but we have
to live here in our little town. We have the town beach, we have the
ramp that Mr. Drum was talking about and in the summertime, it is loaded,
with Jersey cars, not our own, but cars from New Jersey. Monday mornings
along our street we pick up the beer bottles and beer cans and like that .
Now, for 28 homes, and I believe I 'm right in this, you need two and
a half spaces per home so that we would have to provide in New Suffolk
parking space for approximately 70 cars. Now, weekends when they have
guests, God knows where they 're going to park and I think in considering
this you have to consider the town itself and what it ' s going to do
to us . If they want to buy it let them take their cars over there,
but we cannot afford to have more parking, people take up,- 4-whole
block. of parking, in New Suffolk, Thank you.
ANDREW GOODALE, New Suffolk, President , New- Suffolk School Board:
Firends., this is a rather unusual audience. I think we have people
who are here for preservation, we have people for private development
and I think we have some people here who are here to see what is
developing. I would say the general consesus is the fact that
there is a gangplank syndrome, obviously, everybody that comes out
to this end of the Island in a few years they say, "Well , pull up
the gangplank, nobody else should come out here . " That may very well
be, some merit , but so far I 've listened to some conclusions and I
haven 't had too much in the way of facts. What I would like to say is
I an, here principally because -the Town Board has a decision to. :make
and I am sure they will give it the. necessary study in order to come
up with the correct decision. Secondly, we 'hear about the uniqueness
of Robins Island: You would think this was the only island on the
whole Atlantic Coast but it is not . You have several islands up off
the Massachusetts coast that are privately developed, privately owned,
and people don ' t go on them for the simple reason is that is the way
they pay their taxes and as such they should be entitled to some privacy.
On one hand we hear all about the privacy which we are entitled to and
on the other hand we are not so sure about the privacy when someone
wants to have it --. these so -called alleged foreigners. I don ' t know
whether they are foreigners or not but I do know that we have a
situation where we get a substantial return for the New Suffolk school
District, and when you take all the islands that are along this coast
and that includes Gardiners Island, `includes Fishers Island, and
Shelter Island which is near by and Block Island, Nantucket , Martha'a
Vineyard, they have set themselves a farily good setup for future
growth. Now, when we get to the point where the liberals, and I say
the liberals because now there is .a swing back to conservatism, we
. find we 're a little busted -in Washington, and the idea is more
or ' less not to be in vogue to give away a billion dollars for this
s
72, APRIL 22, 1980
study or a billion dollars for that or a million or whatever we are
going to give away because we don '-t have that kind of money any more.
I know I have lived in New Suffolk for over 50 years and I 've looked
at Robins Island and it is a beautiful island, I will agree. But the
question is, that if' 28 families are going to develop it, they are
going to covenant and they are going to leave a big open space-in
the middle, then I think they should be entitled to that opportunity
to present to the Planning Board and get the results of that study and
I think this is the democratic way to look at it . Now, when you
look at what the government is going to do, and', I say the government in
general, a few years ago on the school board we had lottery. They were
going to give us everything, you won ' t have to worry any more. When
we have a lottery people are going to flock to gamble and they are
going to give you- back enough money so you won 't have to worry about
your expenses . Last year we got '$300 as part of the lottery which was
going to come to New Suffolk and we havena',t gotten any more in the way
of state aid than we got in 1965 which is the hold harmless provision
which is $3900. What we are saying here is that bureaucracy has a
tendancy to expand an .invert proportion to need and that is the trouble
with some of this country, that we are expanding too fast and spending
too much money but we don 't know ehere we are going to get the money
from and when you take land off the tax rolls for the reasons that
have been advanced I think it ' s wrong. I- think that we should have
that kind of income and I think it should be assured. Not only that ,
the State of New York, when they take some of your property they will
give you a grant only to the extent. of what the tax base was at the
time it was taken, Section -545 of the Real Property Law. And when
they have given you whatever proportion that they decide will take
care of you that ' s the end of it and you will get no more and then
it becomes a tax situation where you are going to have rangers if
you are going to have some kind of conservationist or whatever you
are going to have that ' s going to - cost money. But, if it is privately
developed you are going to get the advantage of having whatever the
tax rate goes up over the years . The world won 't come to an end
one way or the other and I can assure you of that . But if it is given
to a development or a municipal purpose the - school no doubt will close .
I personally went to that school but that isn ' t going to be the last
thing in the world as far as I am concerned, but we do .have an
economical school . For several .-years we have been at the lowest . point
in the tax expenditures for that particular school . If w pass it
on to the next school board or school district you are going to find
it is going to be an added burden -on everybody so everybody is going
to pay eventually, there is no free lunch. What I am saying is that
I had some dialogue and has been quoted that Mr . Noto was in favor
of this we have a letter which came from Mr. 'Behan, John L. Behan in
Montauk and will just quote to you, "To me the most wensible plan
would be the reasonable development of Robins Island. The development
proposal that has been made to me seems to be a' sensible one and I
do not feel that the .beauty or the ecological balance ' of Robins
Island would be destroyed by this -kind of limited developemnt . Further
it would become :a further tax benefit to your school district and
also the Town of Southold. " He said a similar situation already
exists on Fishers Island. which has limited development . "If anything
Robins Island would be less development than Fishers Island. It
certainly cannot be said that Fishers Isalnd has had its beauty
diminished or has had its environment spoiled by the limited develop-
ment that has occured on that Island. " I would just like to make one
further point in. connection with the development and that would be
along the lines that where you have something that we know is working,
we know that it is bringing a substantial return to our tax, that it-
will give to this ,end of the island a boost in terms of further
development I would,-,say that we should be for it . Thank you very
much.
ROBERT WACKER, Cutchogue : I just want to make one brief comment .
I think some of you may remember that Al 'Martocchia used to say
that there never was a real estate development yet that paid its
onw way. When a real estate development' moved in it would pay the
taxpayer for .the Town Board to acquire that land at the speculators
price and convert it into a park because when the houses come and
the people come and the chiltdren come and the police needs come and
development consumes more in costs than' it pays back in taxes. Mr .
Goodale and the people who - seem to believe that these Germans are
Santa Claus are just being starry eyed. They' re, not going to pay
that money and want nothing for it. It is going' to cost more than
it brings in.
APRIL 22, 1980
JEAN TIEDKE, Southold: , .I am speak.i,n'g,.;.-for. the. -Suffolk County League
of Women Voters.. We supported the:lstudy of. the marine sanctuary
which included Robins Island. We feel that there has been too much
emotional and political pulling involved,. ,that very few hard facts
have been presented on either side of this discussion about Robins
Island or about the .value or lack of value of a marine sanctuary.
If you. as Town Board members do not know the answers to all of your
questions and all our questions why did you turn down the $50, 000
marine sanctuary study fund which included Robins Island? We- deserve
an explaination from each one of you..
MICHAEL MATTES , Mattituck: I would like to direct _a question to Mr .
Sullivan . Mr. Sullivan, a .little bit earlier, today, stated that
( I 'm paraphrasing) the majority of the people in Southold don ' t
support accquisiton. May I ask you how you arrived at that conclusion?
MR. SULLIVAN: The people that I 've talked with and called me and
ventee. their feelings towards me, I come to- that conclusion. '
MR. MATTES : How many people did you speak to one way or the other ,
Mr. Sullivan?
MR. SULLIVAN: Twenty-five.
MR. MATTES : Was there a petition circulated in opposition to the
acquisition.:of Robins Island?
MR. SULLIVAN: No .
MR. MATTES: .Was there a petition circulated in favor of the acquisiton
of Robins Island?
MR. SULLIVAN: . Probably there was .
MR. MATTES : - There was, there were about 2300 signatures on that
versus the twelve people that you claim -contacted you. . Would you
say, therefor.e, . that the majority of the people as repr.esented. by
those figures -are opposed to the acquisition of Robins Island, Mr .
Sullivan?
MR. SULLIVAN.: You asked me how many people had talked tome
specifically.
MR. MATTES :. Now, you made a' statement earlier that the majority of
the people you feel in the Town of Southold--
MR. SULLIVAN: That talked to me.
MR. MATTES : That '.s not,,the way it sounded, Mr . Sullivan. Second of
all you also stated it is probably illegal to reimburse. the Town and
school district for:. taxes.
MR. SULLIVAN: I question the legality of. that .
MR. MATTES : Well., I might state as a matter of fact, in the case .
of the Rocky Point School District, the State of New York has been
and is currently reimbursing them for loss of revenue represented
by the transfer of the RCA transmitting property there to the State
of New York. They are , being reimbursed 100% for taxes lost . I also
would like. .to:::make._ a_-statement concerning the school district . I
feel very deeply that people should not have to suffer additional
taxes. I certainly don ' t like paying taxes and I know none of the
people here do, but it bothers me that some of the people in the
school district would feel it is a one-way street, that they would
only get tax money and they would not have to put up any services.
Also, if perhaps they feel there would not be any school children.,
coming into the district . Maybe the Southold Town Board could
legislate birth. control for the people living on that island, 'I
don 't know. But in any .event , the students coming in are definitely.
going to require services and with the greater number ofstudents
coming in you are definitely going to have to provide more services .
It ' s not a one-way street . They are going to require more. services,
you undoubtedly would have a certain number of student sthat require
special services, disabled children, etcetera, etcetera. I would
just like to bring that to the school district ' s attention_. Thank
you.very much.
74 - APRIL 22, 1980
ANDREA RIVE, New Suffolk: I think you are in receipt of my letter
so you know I am in opposition to the county acquisiton. Tonight,
in the interest of brevity, I would just like to ask you how you
can reconcile preservation of Robins Island with 100 visitors a day
traipsing all over the Island and picnicing and what provisions do
you intend to make to transport those people there. Do these include
private boat owners who would begch .their boats and picic<:,without_
going through the regular channels?
SUPERVISOR PELL: Yes, Article No . 3 . in may plan says, "That the -manage-
ment policies be assigned to the Town of Southold so that -effective control
of .the Island" is at the Board ' s level . This Board will set-:;the
number of people that will go on the island. This Board will control
the island. This Board will have the say of how the people get on it
and off . The control will be with your elected officials which I am
one sixth. There are six members on this Board, I have one sixth vote.
It is the people you put in office and, the elected officials who will
have the management control . That is how I expect to _contro.l it . . Through
the people- who you pick to represent you.
MS . RIVE : I was just calling your attention to how many people would
visit the island.
ARTHUR KENNIFF, Southold: Mr. Supervisor, Board members, ladies and
gentlemen. I had not intended to speak this evening. I did not come
with prepared brief but I have first hand knowledge or Robins Island
over the last twenty years. My very good friend John MacKay owned the
island for most of that period. There has been several proposals of.
uses for the island. At one time Curtis Wright had a deposit on the
island in the amount of six million dollars. The county then released
a statement to the press saying it was the county ' s intention to purchase
the island. That was enough to kill that sale . Then when the county
said they were going to purchase the island the local residents objected
to the fact the island would bring more people to the area than a
development would have . So we have been on both dides of the creek.
I 've heard people. speak of the . fact there might be children on the
island. There have been children on that island several times'- in the
last twenty years. The town is not -required to send boats or trans
portation for them, Mr . MacKay provided it . I would assume the same
situation would prevail with anybody else who was on the island. I 've
heard mention of people with 2000 some petition signatures. There is
onw very, easy way you can preserve the island if you wish .to and that ' s
the purchase of it and--keep it on the tax rolls and pay the taxes as
Mr. MacKay did .for almost twenty years. I 've heard people mention
they won property .in New Suffolk. . I 'a1so own property in New Suffolk.
We also run a business in New Suffolk and it has 'been very very
difficult to run over the period of years because of the non-develop-
ment situation that arises. It has taken me two and a half years to
get the. permits to rebuild the bulkheads that were damaged during
1977 ice capade we had in this area. I feel the best thing that can
happen to this island is controleed development . If we stand still
as the western end did we 're going to be unindated with people . You
cannot have a bedroom community in this area, it is not within
commuting distance to New York. There is no industrial complex
in the "hear .area that can sustain a bedroom community. The young
people, my children included, have had to go elsewhere to find
employment and ,it will continue to be so ' as long as we sometimes put
our heads in the sand, I 'm for development ..
VANA JAHN, Greenport : For the past hour and a half most of the people
who have stepped -forward indicated that for one reason or another they
are in favor of preserving , the . i.sland. I " concur 100% with these
people and I. would like to. go a step further. By allowing a group
of private individuals to preserve the island I think the Town of
Southold would be served better because if you compare a well groomed
privately owned piece of property with a parkin which monies have
to be invested in order to .achieve the same effect you will simply
come to the same conclusion. Furthermore do I believe that by
allowing the island to be purchased by the state or by the county
tax money will - have to be spent and this money has to come from
somewhere and usually out of our pockets and that means everybody
in this room. Whether it is federal , state or county money it had
been paid at some time or another by us. If we allow this island to
be developed in. a way that -- the .way it . has been proposed by 28
homes I don ' t think that anyone' in his right mind who has children
would want to live on that island. If I would be ' faced with that
APRIL 22, 1980
decision and I had children I would certainly'ask the question, how
would I get them to school? So would anybody else. Finally, I
would like to mention to the, gentleman over there who spoke about
the distance from Hamburg, Germany to here . It ' s a very short one .
I ' ve traveled that distance . I chose to live in this country because
it' s the last country, perhaps, where you can pursue a career without
having to be curtailed by some form of government where you are allowed
to own property.. If you go to Hamburg, Germany or further east only
60 miles you wouldn ' t be allowed to own property, wouldn' t be allowed
to speak out because government has taken over completely. Not like
here where we are allowed to step over and talk freely without fear .
Those people cannot and I think it is important to preserve -this and
let anyone who wishes to live here, when they are foreigners or .not ,
to do so. Thank you very much.
STEVE WICK, Cutchogue : For those that euphemistically refer to
something as limited development , there is no such thing. There is
development and there is no development . There is no such thing as
limited development . I think if you read case law you will find that
if "someone buys a plot of land he can do with it pretty much as he
choses . If someone buys 12- acres of Robins Island he might sell 11
to his"friends and I think that any development would be wrong at
this time. Thank you.
ADDY SCHREIBER, Southold: I am going to make the shortest statement
I have made in all. t.hose God blessed years. I am a summer resident
since 26 years, I was in New Suffolk. I 'm an all year round. resident.
since seven years in Southold. Once developed I give a fiar warning
to the real estate owners and home owners around New" Suffolk harbor
that when this invasion is going to take place, because 28 homes will
be 280 homes in ten years and all those who are going to vote against
preservation will be roasting in Hell by everything. what the grand-
children are going to wish for them. But those who live right out
here and have real estate property, don!t forget that their property
value, if that invasion takes place, will go down besides the school
board president , services demanded by those people who are going to
be 28 homes or 280 homes because more than the $3 . 70 cents . And as,
the last sentence, if you want to I 'm going to go house by house and -
collect Mr. President of the School Board the $3 . 70 in order .to save- it .
Thank you.
CARL VAIL, Southold : Mr . -Supervisor, Town Board: I am not in , the
habit of making many. speeches, I have been trying to make a little,
mark in the last 61 years and I think I have the dubious distinction, .
possibly, of being the only active automobile dealer left on Long
Island with 61 .years experience.- I have been through any number- of
depressions and this one is entirely a different one and I '.m afraid
not all of you people realize the situation. In any business our
insurance is way up, our labor is way up, our material is way up, our
heat and light is way up and there ' s no way out of it and anything that
we do should be in the light of whether our fellow townsmen can stand
any tax increase whatsoever or whether they are going to be able .to
pay the taxes that they will be faced with in the next few years. Now,
as far as county owned things and park commissions and various things,
it seems to me that Long Island has more park area counting tine county,
the town and everything that any other part of New York State. It ' s -
some problem to know and trust ., The County Park Commission has fooled
us twice so far. Now, supposen this jurisdiction ,is turned over to
the town and they start folling us . Where are we going to be at?
Now, Camp Dunes was taken . over by the county, ohm no, we aren ' t going
of have a boy 's camp. Oh, no, it 's going to be a park. And three
months it was opened up to a boy' s camp, they put a cyclone fence
around everywhere so you can ' t get on it and on top of that previous
to that they had one man caretaker taking care of the .whole thing
and the- net result we got three guys sitting- around there playing
cards year in and year out , virtually to take care of the thing. They
took over Cedar Island with a beautiful light. house for 125 year,
all carpeted, red carpet up the staris with case after case of glass-
ware and outside building with diesel motors to furnish power on that
thing and three. weeks the whole thing was tore to peices, the tiolet
was gone out , there -isn 't a window, left in it . There it , is . And the,
first thing they did was take the planks off the dock so nobody could
land there. Now, who ,are we going to believe . Are we going to turn
this thing over to the town and trust them to handle the park and keep
people. out . It costs money to keep people out . I don ' t know whether
you realize that there ' s 200, 000 people, automobile factory employees,
walking the streets and that ' s one out of every four employees in the
APRIL 22, 1980
automobile factories . Now, the automobile industry and allied indust '
ries employ one out of every seven 'people 'employed' and you take the
housing situation, you add that and you 'find that' practially one out of
every seven people are employed in either housing; lumber yards,
carpenters,. Now, we 're facing a very serious situation in this country.
We have a President and a Congress dedicated to -the theory that by
setting the country intoa depression they can stop inflation. We 've
got a President and a Senator Javits that still believe in Salt II after
Russia ' s performance. Somebody' s crazy.
FRANK BEAR, Southold: I will be very brief . I 'd just like to find
out if the people who are -- feel that the New Suffolk School District
is .going to gain from this and those who see a gain in taxes on behalf
of the people who already live:_here . I was a member of the Baldwin
School Board back in the 501s . A few years after my wife and I moved _
there with our two children in 1946 , at that time we drove through
farmland to get from Baldwin to Rockville;'Centre. A few years after
that there were houses built , there were developments. I recall at
the time, about 1952 that there was concern about what we -were going
to do with all the children that were being born there. First, nobody
is going to be born on Robins Island, because somehow or another the
people there do .not have the same king of desire as usual . - We had a
man in charge of a. study who would get up in front of the group and
say, "I 'm telling you, in a few years, , we ' re going to ,have a tax rate
of $5 . 00. 11 At that time it was around. $2 :00, and now it ' s up some
where around $12 . 00 of $14 . 00, I 'm not quite sure what, because I 'm
not there .now and the result was at that time schools: had to be'
built , streets had to be built , fire departments had to be increased
in size, police services had to be increased adn the result was that
we .had to pay more in taxes . The schools that were built in the 50 ' s
are still being paid for . The 30 year bond issues are still running
on most, of those schools, in fact , all eseept one and some will be'
going on- for another ten years or so . The experience everywhere has
been that development costs more and not less in tuxes .. Thank. you.
SHIRLEY CROCKER, Southold : Mr. Pell, I just_ wanted to know if you
would clarify -a statement you made bfore that you would see to it
that people are kept off the island. Ifr:the county acquired it,
would it not be open to all county residents and wimll not this
qualify all our local residents, so .how can be police it and keep
people off the island.'
SUPERVISOR PELL: Under the program I put forth the management policies
to manage Robins Island would be assigned to the Southold _Town Board
Your elected officials, under this. program, would be the ones who set
the rules and regulations and other management policies under my
proposal .
MRS . CROCKER: , I know, but it would still be open to all the people
in the Town of `Southold.
SUPERVISOR PELL: Dr. Koppelman can answer that- but under my proposal
if it is going to be a limited amount of people allowed on that
island and who ' s going to be allowed on that island would be under
this Town Board' s management regime -- is under the Town Board under
my proposal .
MRS . CORCKER: That 's i.f you acquire it .
SUPERVISOR PELL; If the county acquires it _under the proposal as
put forth.
MRS . CROCKER: That ' s something, I don' t understand. If. the county
acquires it we all pay taxes to the county, it certainly should be
open to all town residents.
SUPERVISOR PELL: Sure, it would be, but the management policy ---
the management policy, Mrs. Crocker, whatever the policies would
be set by your Town 'Board.-
W.ILLIAM GOLDER; I 'd-like-to -- may i answer that question. I can
answer teh question that the lady asked: If anyone, probablt some
of you here have been to connetquot . Now, Connetquot was a millionaires
preserve up at Oakdale. Wonderful trout fishing, sonderful game,
it:, is the only place on the Island I know still has wild turkey,
deer, everything. Now, they have a limited '-- you have to ask,
APRIL 22, 1980 7
you have to request permission to:..go : there andit renews your, faith
in government. officials, the way that' is 'run ,under Mr. Gil Bergen
who runs it . It is so efficient, it is so clean and .the people .
who go there -- I go there trout fishing. Now,; when I first went
there I couldn' t believe there was any place like it . There ' s
better trout fishing there than there is in Canada or any place I
have been trout fishing and it ' s hard to believe if the .planes
weren' t going overhead, it ' s hard to believe. that you aren ' t in the
wilds of Canada or even Alaska and when I first went there four years
ago, I said, this won' t last long., It can ' t even last a year, it ' s
impossible, it!-s just going to be destroyed. But it hasn 't beenm
even I pick up, a piece of .paper if I see one and I don ' t even pick
up -my clothes . Now, the way it works , you have to telephone in,
make your. reservation. Now, that is for the fishing. It also
takes care of older people and for school children, school children
ark there but thye have guides and everything is done. You would
have to be there, I can 't hardly explain it . You make an appointment .
By appointment only, limited, and it is heaven on this earth and it ' s
on Long Island and any of you can go .there and enjoy a day .in the
country that Tiffany, the President and ,everytting .from---the past
two hundred years have enjoyed and they were millionaires and we 're
not and we can enjoy it . It is wonderful and as I . say,. -you .have your
choice of .parks or cement from one side of the Island to the other.
Now, suppose New York City didn ' t have Central Park and a few other
things_, where would the people go? There is no place. Believe it
or not it ' s coming here whether we like it or not . You can see every
year the way the population explosion is taking c-ar.e of things, There
is just not going to be enough land no matter how much you get . You
won ' t have enough parks for people, but the choice is up to your self .
This is just my opinion . Thank you very kindly.
MICHELLE KOUSOMONO, New Suffolk: I 'live in New Suffolk, Z have three
children, two .of .which who have been in New Suffolk School ar vari.ous .
times .. I also own. property in New Suffolk and I would like to say
something very brief about the taxes in New Suffolk. We have, as
far as , I Know, the lowest taxes of anybody around, no one can believe
the amount that I pay in taxes.- But the fact is ,,when I tell people.
what I pay in one year who live in western-Suffolk or Nassau,. they
say, that ' s what I. pay in one month in taxes. ' For . us to be stingy
about a few more dollars to save something which is. basically the
reason we all live here, is the beauty of the place is really being
very silly. Thank you.
SAMUEL _MARKEL; Southold: I really believe. that this is such., a hot
potato in this Town .perhaps we should go to a referendum,. and .since
referendums cost_ money and .it costs the taxpayers,- money, I further
suggest that we take a straw vote . Now, that works very well and
I know that then everybody in Town will get . an equal opportunity to
say what they want and give our Board a chance to really consider the
facts according to what the people think and not just the pros and
cons of people who came out here tonight . I know there ' s a lot of
.people who didn't get out here tonight to talk and I think those
people would go to a straw vote or referendum. Thank you.
SUPERVISOR PELL: I would like . to ask. Dr . Lee Koppelman to address
the floor, Please.
DR. LEE E. KOPPELMAN, Director Suffolk County Planning Department :
Supervisor Pell, other distinguished members of .the Town Board, I do
appreaciate the Supervisor ' s invitation to be here.-, The eloquence I
heard tonight is unmatched in my thirty years in ' public life so I
will not try to compete with the citizens in your Town in any way .
I heard a. lot of commentary. I believe all of -it- sincere and as
several spokesmen said, they were short on facts and rather than
argue the case directly I would prefer to try and answer some of the
questions that were implicit in the various issues. First I think
everyone, pro. or con, has to understand that what we are discussing '
here tonight , the Town Board' s- resolution, is only a first step. The
marine sanctuary, whether you .support it or do 'not support it , is dead.
That has to be understood. That means 'there is -only one option if
Robins Island is to be saved and that is the resolution that is now
before the Town Board. . Now, this particular resolution was specifically
drafted to answer the concerns of the people who -spoke at . all the
previous occasions. Issue number .one :. would the:-,federal government
impose control? Under . this resolution, in .no. way. Would. the State
of New York take away home rule prerogative?. Under this resolution,
in no way. Would the Town Board of the Town of Southold set a policy
APRIL 22, 1980
to protect the people of the Town? If' this resolution is carried to
its fruition, the answer is yes. The Supervisor even provided the
question of the tax. base and I think . the young woman who courageously
said, and honestly,' that this particular school district has the
lowest taxes of virtually all the school district in Suffolk County.
But let us see what the issues are . If the Town, Board, in ,my opinion,
exercises the wisdom to support this resolution, that does not guarantee
that the county will follow through. That ' s what I mean by first step .
I think the most disasterous posture that could be taken would be to
translate this into a partisan issue. It is absolutely not . At the
height of the Civil War, Yosemity and the' Redwood Forest was set forth
as a priority by President Lincoln when he was worried about having
General Grant is his front parlor for breakfast . At the time when
this country ' s survival was at Stake President Lincoln took a step
that no other president had ever taken in the history of this country
and that was to be concerned about the National Wilderness in apart
-of the nation he had never -seen. That ' s fact . ` In 1905 President
Theodore Roosevelt called the first 'Governor ' s Conference to establish
the national policy for the creation. of the National Park Service .
Now, perhaps in a partisan way, Democrats are like the Russians-, they
try and grab the credit f.or every damn good idea that' s ever come on
this earth. Well, let me say, if there is -partisanship to -our God given
commandment to be shepards of the earth and protect what the good Lord
has given us, then I would think the Republican party, rightfully, could
claim for credit -in this society for doing- it , if it were a partisanship,
but it is not . When -we- voted for parks in this county in 1960 four out
of five -Suffolk resident'-', voted for parks and if it were partisan, let
me observe, sir, that since the overwhelming= enrollment in this county
happens to be Republican, then again the good sense of the honest
Republicans in this county have preserved the parks that we have. I
would point out at the state level, to the gentlemen who said Suffolk
County has more parks than any other part of the State of New York,
I could only say would the good- Lord make that a fact . Unfortunately,
it is not . About 3% of Suffolk' s real- estate is in county parks.- 3%.
On the, other hand- a governor by the name of Rockefeller worked very
diligently to create and preserve the Adirondack Wilderness which far
exceeds anything we could ever achieve in Suffolk and he also initiated
the step for the Catskill Preserve. So, again gentlemen, if you're
concerned...:about party . idiology, then I would submit loyality 'would
demand -support of -park preservation. Now let ' s look "at some of the
questions under that basis . If this Town Board ' passes a resolution,
the real battle will be before the Suffolk 'Legislature. If this
amount of people could ever be brought before the- Suffolk legislature,
I think it would be a miracle in - itself, but it would lead to success,
because we do have 'a responsive form of government. 'In terms of straw
votes .or referendum, we are a republic . We elect people to be responsive
to us . We hold ;public hearings to get the voice of the people. In all
this debate on the acquisit.on of Robins Island I' heard from one citizen
in opposition. A very. respected member of the realty profession who
is a res'ident -of this Town,. who sent me three letters to which I
responded, each letter adding on in length and we mutually agreed that
we were on -opposite sides of the fence. One .letter of opposition.
Well over 100, and I didn ' t bother counting, "but well over 100 according
to my log of p'eople who callkd in favor of the proposition from this
Town, not from other parts of the County. Now let us look at some of
the other parts of the questions that were raised:' One of the distinguished
members of the Town Council was concerned that if this is placed in a
Nature Trust that this could be abrogated. Well ,. in a democratic
society anything can be abrogated. Let me tell you what the process
is . If this property is purchased, it would first be purchased and
dedicated legally under the State Constitution for- park purposes.
In order for a park to be 'disposed of, and even the most powerful
Mr:, Moses learned to his chagrin when he tried -to slice - off a half
acre: df Central Park f.or a restaurant . 'that even he couldn't get
around the State Constitution. If you wish to sell dedicated park
land you have to have' two -consecutive acts of the State Legislature
and it is subject to -a permissive referendum by the people. I can' t
think of any device that guarantees that once a park is dedicated it
remains. The Nature Trust is a further proviso . This is a proviso
that elected officials should be conscious of because it was voted
by referendum, for' 'the gentlemen who is concerned by referendum, by
the people of Suffolk County,- to create the Conservation Bill of Rights
which establishes a proviso for a Nature Trust ,and for a Historic
Trust , whoch further ties in perpetuity the protection of' these lands,
and it responds to the complaint of the people that. parks are not
necessarily in the best interest either of 'ecolo'gy or of the community
APRIL 22, 1980 'I C9
if they become overrun'. There :axe" pxopert :es- 'that should be preserved.
Our four rivers in terms of river wilderness area: This type of
property is similar. in nature . Now, I heard a great deal of in-
consistency from people who got up and said, "Let ' s preserve our
rural way of' life, "which T applaud, I support . I didn 't . recommend
in 1960 the preservation of farmland because I wished to see either
the economy or the- beauty of this area dissappear., but if one is going
to be 'logical,, rational and consistent , you cannot argue for . preservation
of your way of life, you can 't -argue to hold on and create a Peconic
County because you wnat to preserve your way of life and at the same
time encourage development in all areas : Now, within the land mass
of Southold there is nothing to .prohibit development from one end of
Southold to the . other . From the Bay to the. Long Island Sound, it . is
all zoned fro development and here we 're talking about 400 acres, and
for the gentlemen who can cite all the islands on the east coast , I
would submit from an ecological point of view, ,we do not live in Maine,
we do not live in Massachusetts and we do not live in Carolina, we live
on Long Island, .and in the Town of Southold there is one island, not a
dozen and it ' s a,minute island. And the choice that you are really
faced with is not limited development and reap a few bucks, but
whether or not you are going to replicate the mistakes of the west .
Now let us talk about facts in terms of covenant . You're being .
sold a bill of goods -if you believe for a moment when any developer
tells you that they ' re only going to do so. much. Even if the
developer is honest and I presume , these people are impeccable .in ,
their integrity. They cannot perceive the future, they are guided
by one element and that is the legal zoning:. Now, ' -if the developer
were to say to this. Town .Board,. "Give us the right: to build 28
houses and set aside 28 one acre legal building lots and surround
each building lot with 9 acres of open space so that in effect each
home would then have ten acres, with the 9 acres being in permanent
dedicated open space, " it could be to the Town, to Nature Conservancy,
it could be to a homeowners organization with a reverter clause that
in the event the homeowners association disappears that open space
automatically goes to government.. If that were to be the case, then
you would be faced with the following subdivison; 28 one acre lots .
and 380 acres in one form or another of permanent preservation, but
that is not what you 're being faced with.. And there is no -legal way
that you could bind future owners of this property' to any, kind. of
covenant . I 've been through this mill numerous times. o.n -private
properties. , Dix .Hills ,in Huntington had a five acre homeowners
covenant and it worked as. long as the original owners supported -it .
At that point in time that the composition of—the--community changed,
the covenant went right out the. window. North Hills, Nassau County,
two acre:.zoning, millionaires community. They didn ' t ; have to worry
about taxes, millionaires community. The majority of the vi-llage .
trustees. owned most of the real .estate, they discovered that if they
changed the zoning from house per two acres to twenty units to the
acre by the stroke of the legislative pen the property appreaci-ated
13 million dollars over night . Well , the school district i!9 going
to benefit., the community is going to benefit ., The only ones who
benefited were the ones who got the appreciation in land value.. Just
let me tell you what happened.. _ Condominum builders have .come,_ very
successful , $150, 000 to $250, 000 houses. One slight problem. They
now have to have sewers, which they don ' t have.: I,-won ' t dwell on
Southwest. Sewer District . Who ' s going to pay this cost , not the
former -trustees who got the appreciation in value but the current,
and future citizens . Now let ' s talk about .count.y policy. There-
have been several -references. to county of.ficials,- including one_ of
my new colleagues in .county government . The county policy is. not
set by the comptroller of the county, nor. his depty, now his
assistants.. It is set by .the legislature and the county executive
and the county policy since 1960 is the preservation of certain property.
And the adopted comprehensive plan, adopted by the Suffolk County
Legislature includes the recommendation for the preservation of Robins
Island. The county executive of Suffolk County appeared before this group
in just such a packed meeting and initiated the suggestion for the '
preservation of- Robins Island. Those are the facts as they now
exist and several speakers, have pointed to the fact that. there is no
way that development in the long run assists your .tax burden. I,n
studying this since I 've been Suffolk County Director since. 1960, if
anyone asked me why do taxes constantly go up, . and let me put this .
in focus, in 1960:,. ladies and gentlemen, when we started- the Charter
form of .governmetn we had 667, 000 citizens in. this ,county. We had
a county budget of under_ $70, 000, 000. That was the budget .. Now in
1980 the population has just doubled, we are a little over 1 .3
million . Last year ' s county budget was $711, 000, 000. , a doubling
.8 0 APRIL 22, 1980
of the population and a thousand percent -increase in the taxation.
Now, from your point of view your lucky, because most of that increase
was in the western five towns, not out here and the reason we 've had
that increase is because of development . Houses do not pay their own
way, and I 'm not suggesting building walls, you people are' not going',-,to .
As your population increases, your taxes are going to go up. But if
you want to encourage those taxes to go up at a faster rate, that ' s
your choice, but you can't have it both ways . The 'late Supervisor
Martocchia was absolutely right, the only thing that really pays the
difference is if you can get an industrial land base with all the
workers living in Brookhaven, . then you're ahead of the game. And
anyone who tells anything to the contrary is giving you myth, not
fact . Those are the facts . Now if there are specific questions that
I could answer I would be happy to try and do so . Supervisor ---
SUPERVISOR PELL: Does anybody wish to ask Dr . Koppelman any questions?
MR. KENNIFF: You indicated that the developers have changed their
minds . I ask you a question, didn ' t in the early 70 ' s the county
say they were no longer interested in Robins Island an- would never
take it for condemnation?
DR. KOPPELMAN:. . Supervisor Klein at the time was offered the island
by Mr. MacKay. The Suffolk County Planning Commission reiterated
its position''of support at the time. We follow county policy on
park acquisiton by going to the local units of government . We went
to Southold as we did when Orient Point came under the block and the
Town of .southold at that time was hesitant on both sides of the issue
and then finally came down negative. The same thing happened on
Robins Island and the response that, we had received was, what do you
need to buy it for, nobody can build on it . I talked to two members
of the Southold Town Planning Board, and they said no problem, when a
developer finds out that he has to have a ferry service and when they
find out the problems and when they find out we 're not going to give
them parking on the mainland there is no way they can develop it .
That was the attitude . The county executive himself was concerned
about his Farmland Program. A meritorious program. ' He felt that
parks would then be in competition. That was his posture . County
policy does change, you're right, Commander. The current county
executive addressing the citizens right in this meeting reiterated
his policy. His policy is positive in terms of Robins Island.
MR. KENNIFF: Then it could be -possible down five or ten years from,
now the county position might change and- we might have the Bronx
Zoo on Robins Island?
DR. KOPPELMAN: If the property is put in the Nature Trust , sir, If
Supervisor ' s Pell ' s resolution is held . up, there 'Is no conceivable
way you could have a Bronx . Zoo but let me observe, if you ahve the
amount of property and terrain that the -Bronx -Zoo has and it was the
desire of the people of ,Southold to have a zoo there are other places
within -the- Town that you could accomodate it-. 'I have no objection of
zoos, I .think they ' re a good public purpose, but not on' Robins " Island.
SUPERVISOR..;.PELL: Councilman Sullivan has a question
COUNCILMAN SULLIVAN: I th nk that what we want to look .at .toni.ght
is that we 're only voting on this specific resolution, we 're not
voting on development or anything. This is still in the Planning Board
jurisdiction, okay? Were voting on a specific resolution, are we
not? Supervisor Pell?
SUPERVISOR PELL: My resolution is to be voted on. We are going to
vote in a few minutes:
COUNCILMAN SULLIVAN: I 'd like to ask Dr . Koppelm.an, you mentioned
Dix Hills . Could you equate the Dix Hills situation with Robins.
Island? Do you think they square with each other? o you think
they square with each other as far as raising of taxes, raising of
services?
DR. KOPPELMAN: Let me observe that a '$60, 000 home in Dix Hills,
which I would assume on a parity ,with ,some of the $60, 000 homes,
say in Nassau Point , okay? I could let ,you address the question of
how .much the taxes- are here in the Town' of -Southold, but I could
tell you -the average taxes there come between $4, 000 and $6, 000
per home, okay? Now, the specific question in that Dix Hills area
APRIL 22, 1980
was that in terms of open space preservation they had a piece of
property, an estate, called the Gwynn Estate which had its own
unique features, not ,on.ly in terms of flora and fauna, but being
the highest point of topography in western Suffolk lounty, therefore;',_!-_ :_".
being the devid.ing ,line of the glacial maraine it had water sheds
of significance as well . If the county didn ' t step in in 1960 to
acquire that as the second county park acquired by the new charter
form of. government those acres would now have homes on them. If
they had 240 homes on it , as proposed, the tax rate in that general
area would have gone up, but more significantly, the environmental
values that were preserved would have disappeared . That ' s basically
what we are . talking about in Robins Island. The question is like
one cannot be a little bit pregnant . You either preserve an
environmental area or you develop it . That is the real choice, that ' s
the essence of the resolution as I understand it .
COUNCILMAN MURDOCK: I 'd like to ask you, Dr. Koppelman, because
this is a new field for me, as most of these people, if the Town
acquires the development rights to the so-called common land, the
attorney for the developer has represented that that would in effect
forever remove the ability to build on any other land. I 'm not talking
now about the ability to change the 28 plots, the common land that
the Town of Southold could acquire the development rights on. If
the Town of Southold did acquire these development rights would that
effectively stop the development of that area?
DR. KOPPELMAN: It would effectively stop the development only on that
hundred some odd acres in the center of the island. The 280 acres
in no way would be prevented from -going to 28 houses to 280 houses .
COUNCILMAN MURDOCK; That ' s what I said to you .
DR. KOPPELMAN: I agree with you, you 're absolutely correct , so you
may have 280 houses. That' s the ultimate choice. .
SUPERVISOR PELL: Councilman Drum, do you have anything?
COUNCILMAN DRUM:: I have no questions . of . the doctor .
DR. KOPPELMAN: I must be in trouble . When we are on good terms
my friend. Henry calls me Lee, now. ---
COUNCILMAN NICKLES :_ I just thought that Lee..maybe could explain
the Nature Trust . I was looking. in your, --- I 'm sure you prepared
this for Peter Cohalan . Under -Nature Preserve and the Open Space
Policy of the county executive it ' s described as--:follows : "Any
area of land or water in public or private ownership which- is
formally dedicated to being mandated as nearly as possible in its
natural condition; which area either retains, to some degree, its
primeval character (though it need not be completely natural and
undisturbed at the time of its dedication) 'or- has unusual floar, fauna,.
geological features of scientific or educational value, and which
area is used in a manner and under limitations consistent with its
continued .preservation, without impairment, disturbance or artificial
development , for the public purposes of .scientific research; education,
aesthetic enjoyment and providing habitat for plant and animal species
and .communities and other natural objects. " Is that what this
resolution we have before us pertains to when the word "Nature Trust"
is used?
DR. KOPPELMAN: That is what the broad definition of Nature Trust is.
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : Then I 'd like to understand .then, if the Town
has the management capabilities, and as Supervisor Pell was quoted
in the paper. as saying, 100 people a day, it could be 10 people or
100 people or 1000 people, how does that . line up with the purpose
of the Nature Trust?
DR. KOPPELMAN: This could be in accord with- the Nature Trust. if
any public use is,-,.such that it doesn ' t impair the natural characteristics .
For example, if the local New Suffolk School Board decided that they
wanted to take a class of kindergarten children to ,the island to learn
something about the ecology of the area,. .that could be. in accord with
the area if they are supervised and they don 't burn down the .trees.,
Similarly audub.on society or anyone else under permit could bird
watch or do those passive things that do not change the natural terrain.
8.24 APRIL 22 , 1980 ~ -
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : In other words then, under a Nature Trust, . is
what you would call passive activities or passive ---
DR. KOPPELMAN: As opposed to active . No ballfields or activities
of that sort .
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : How about picnic benches and places for_ cooking -
outdoor cooking, things like that?
DR. KOPPELMAN: Outdoor cooking normally is not put in a Nature Preserve
because of the obvious question of fire controland so on. In the
county parks that are limited use, not passive use, like. the Nissequo-
gue Park or Blydenburgh Park we have both. We have certain areas that
we don ' t allow use in, we don ' t allow areas that are used .for camping,
for picnicing and for limited use. On a property of this sort the
passive would be, in this case, the prime policy.
COUNCILMAN NICKLES: In other words, you would have to have some
credentials to go there, either be an audubon member or school
teacher taking a class ---
DR. KOPPELMAN: No, .you don ' t have to have credentials but what
presumably you would have, if the Town were managing ,it , and I
only throw this out as one idea, it ' s not the only way of doing it,
you could have a permit system. It ' s not merely a question of calling
up and saying, we want to go to the island, but that you acquire a
permit for its use, and that ' s what many of the state preserves do,
require at the present time .
MR. KENNIFF: Where do. you intent to get the parking for these people
and ,who is going to take these people to the island, would this be a
commerical ferry or one of the county ' s?
DR. KOPPELMAN; Which people are you talking about , sir .
MR. KENNIFF: The people we are talking about right now, the audubon
society, whoever is going to go over and watch the birds . They can ' t
walk across the water.
DR. KOPPELMAN: I won ' t attempt to be blasphemous or overrespond to
that comment except to say that it would be under the rules and
regulations as up by the Town Board: If there is no provision .
for parking and there is no provision for access then the ultimate
passive use of the property for virtually unhurian habitation or
lack of human habitation would come forth. From my personal observation
if the island were quiet and protected as is. without trespass, that
would be the ultimate gain .
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : Lee, I just had one more question and in this
open space program there are it .areas .that Mr:. .Cohalan, :has put, down
as proposed park acquisitions-and one is -- I 'm sure you are familiar
with them but maybe the people aren' t . Site 1.. is Baiting Hollow/Roanoke
Point , 363 acres in Riverhead, Barcelona Neck, 355 acres in East Hampton,
Carrls River. , . 29 acres in Babylon, Carmans River properties, 430 acres
in Brookhaven, Dwarf Pine Forest , 190 acres in Southampton_ , Gardiners
Island, 3, 380 acres in East Hampton, you have a note here it is possibel
to preserve Gardiners Island by means of a family
trust established in perpetuity, Long Pond Greenbelt, .800 acres in
Southampton, Map Swamp-Birch Creek, 2, 000 acres in Southampton,.
Nissequogue River , 50 acres in Smithtown, Peconic River, 1, 250 acres in
Riverhead and Brookhaven and finally Robins Island, . 460 acres in
Southold. Amounting to 9, 307 acres and as I Understand it just in
county parkland we are just under 16, 000 acres. Where do you place
the priorities on this list?
DR. KOPPELMAN: Priority has laready .been established... The, Gar.diner
Property, and I 've been in direct negotiation not only with the
Gillettes but with counsel for the estate holders, the people who
have fiduciary responsibilities, and without betraying confidences,
I don 't believe I am, I 'm personally. content ,, and several people
made the observation-that if private people would maintain the,
estate as a private estate, if Mr . MacKay were able to maintain
it as he, had over the previous 20 years we would not be here tonight .
On Gardiners Island I am content , having seen the legal documents on
which this trust is run, that there ' s no danger that we will- suffer
the loss of Gardiners Island now or in the forseeable future and
that is why we did not indicate it for county acquisition. In terms
APRIL 22, 1980 83,-
of the priority.: list, there are'- two `pr orities' that the county
executive is pushing, right at the present time and by pushing I
mean for inclusion in the capital program. The first one is Robins
Island and the second one is Maple Swamp . Those are the two that
are under active consideration by the -county executive at the present
time. I might . add, Councilman Nickles, that the reason that Robins
Island isa top priority is because it is in imment danger of being.
lost whereas several of the other properties are not .
COUNCILMAN MURDOCK: ' I would like -- I find it difficult to weigh
the original version of the people who wanted to preserve the pristine
nature of Robins Island in that any human habitation or any human use
was going to destroy the value of the island. —In my deliberations I
tried to see if this is a valid view point . ` Now the same people are
now saying, I 'm sorry, I shouldn ' t say the same people are now saying,
it is now being represented that 100 people a day enjoying the island
is very peaceful use are coexistent with the. people who say any human
use destroys their interpretation of the value of that island.
DR. KOPPELMAN: I think you are asking a very valid question and the
only way it can be answered it that we are dealing with degrees and
one can get involved in fanaticism as well . The difference between
controlled environmental studies., say by bird watchers or children
studying ecology, who -come in for a daytime excursion and leave or
part of a day or whatever it may be, does not have the impact that
houses have in the sense that first of all when you have even --- I
don-!t know where the 100 figure came, I suppose from the Supervisor
who picked it out of the air .. I think that was probably a cavalier
response, sir, and I don ' t mean to be critical but you may determine
that you may want to limit it to 15 people a day, that may be your
decision. The difference, whoever; is that even if you had 100 people
a day, the trees that were there in the morning would be . there in the
evening. The animals that were there in the morning would be there
in the evening'. Once you come in with say initial 28 houses on those
portions you' ll have destroyed whatever cover is in that area. I
would also observe that in terms of 'water usuage, if these people are
as . affluent .as we presume, we 're going to be talking about 75 to 100
gallons of potable water, per capita, per day and that is,' according
to Dr. Schreiber, .minimum. I would accept that . That water which
is now pristine, due to -human use, would be far from pristine once
it sent through 'a sanitary system. If these homes are right at the
edge of the water, and that' s my understanding of the subdivision
layout , this cesspool affluent is going to leach in one direction.
The hydrogeology of the island is such that whatever leaches, ' not in
one year, riot in two' years, perhaps not in five years, but eventually
it is going to leach into the Bay . o, the objective of saving' Robins
Island .is a duel objective.. I listen to the baymen, .I listen to the
fishermen, I listen to the recreational users; go down to Great South
Bay vyhere 'Great South Bay is closed because of coliform contamination
and come out here to this bay where 'the water is virtually pristine .
Housing development of 28 houses will nto have a great 'impact .
Councilman, you are absolutely correct, but my concern is not
whether it is going to be 28 houses or as 'a planner I would have
to say to you that as long as the legal zoning is one acre and it
is difficult to- get the court to sustain a more restrictive zoning,
except in rare cases, what you real'ly' have to face, whether it happens
now or ten years or you may be correct , you may only. -have 28 houses
for the next� 20 years, but ultimately .the practice has been such that
density follows legal zoning .and as a planner I would have to say to.
you in all candor that when I look at Robins Island. I don 't look at
it as today, I look as 'it in terms of the future of this county and
that future would indicate to me 280 homes and I would .tell you 280
homes would not only contaminate the ground water on that island but
it would contaminate a portion of the bay. And let me observe, if
you are concerned about taxes, and we should be, we now have a problem
on a similar island, just north of Sag Harbor, North Haven. Limited
area, limited- population, but they built the island, one acre zoning,
in some places two acre zoning, but they covered the island from shore
to shore . Now they are concerned about where they are going. to. get
potable water, so .they went to the water district but unfortunately
they don !t have a- water district .so they had to' 'go to Sag Harbor .
Sag Harbor said, yes, we ' ll be happy to bring a pipe over there.
This was three years ago . The price three years ago was $3, 000, 000.
I would suspect the price today would probably be considerably higher .
$3, 000, 000. - to rbing a pipe to provide water . If you want to examine
what that would do to the tax base I leave it to your imagination. I
would ask you, in terms. of your responsibility, if you want to consider
QA,, APRIL 22, 1980
all the factors on subdivision, you .would ultimately have to consider
=. `..,.",sewage disposal, garbage .collection and again if this. is an affluent
_community they 're going to ,produce garbage at an even faster .rate than
some of us .poorer .people. What are you going to 'do with .the garbage?
. Are you going to bury it on the island 'or are you going to ship it'::
over here to the Town? These are serious questions, . they've. not
light ones . So all these things I would respectfully urge that you
give due consideration to . .
COUNCILMAN. NICKLES : Lee, as I 'm sure you are aware, the Town Board
is --- although we have a. resolution before us, but .obviously it is
apparanet that the Town Board is concisering various options . that
are available. and of -course, one of the things that we- considered
was that being that an island is -unique that you could have special
zoning for an island and we could change the zoning on Robins Island
or any other island that happened to be if we .did have another one
within the Town ,and -that would be enforceable. Now you' re basing
some of .your --- laying out some of the bad things that could happen
in the future and- of course the Town Board is trying to evaluate
what is best for the Town. Not what is best for. Suffolk County of
the people of Long Island. What is best for Southold Town. And of
course in examining that .we pretty much know that the county has
this slated for acquisition, ti may .involve state money, it . may
involve federal money, we don 't know at this time . If I don ' t lose
the thread of my thought , .it is our understanding that if we can
create special zoning for an island and . that would take care of the
28 lots . And as. Mr. Murdock said that the development has offered to
us to sell all of the development right,, or practically give them
to us for a nominal sum, of those 202 acres,- which would include
the northwest wetlands .area, the center section., an area along the
northwest edge also that has environmentally fragile - areas, .so that
the lots would be set back at that portion according to the preliminary
map i have seen and again at the South Race. I understand that they
would also b.e. willing to enter into covenants with ,us .on the 28 lots
and make- the Town a. convenator . We would be joint ownership, so to
speak, on those 62 acre lots, which by the way we are talking one
house .,for .every 15 acres, so_. it would appear we might have --- you
could tell me the validity of this, we might have a .barrier, one,.
wiht a covenant to the. Town and maybe even .the Planning Board adn
even your office being joint covenantors on the 28 lots. We would
have the zoning which would say you couldn ' t' have a lot . less than
six acres or 6 V acres on Robins Osland which is. a special zoning.
The developer turns overall the development rights. which insures
in perpetuity, of until such time as the people of Southold Town
would have a referendum, and I think would operate the same as our
county --- Mr. Kleins County Acquis.iton Program and Development
Rights . How would that , what I de.scribed .to you, which I -hope was ---
I 'm not quite as eloquent as you or some of .the other folks out here ---
stand up?
DR. KOPPELMAN: If you are saying, by covenant , a mutual agreement
vis a vis those 15 acre-lo.ts as oppsoed to the developer saying,
as with the interior parcel , that they would immediately turn the
development rights over to the Town.- I would submit for your consider-
ation that, you are dealing with .two issues . As I answered Councilman
Murdock., if you get the development rights then .you have them,
providing that the transfer of the development rights is in a park
trust in perpetuity. The farmland program is not in perpetuity.
If the Suffolk Legislat.ure. in. the future wants to pull the plug, .
based on. future wisdom, they can do so.
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : But thye must have a referendum of the ..people
of Suffolk county, is. ,my understanding,.
DR. KOPPELMAN: Permissive. The point is it ' s.. flexible.
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : So when John Kleint1.told us that the farm;-program
was only good as long as he was ..co.unty executive, that ' s what he
meant?
DR. KOPPELMAN: Yes, sir, that ' s what .he meant . Now in terms of the
development rights,. if you get .the development rights in perpetuity,
and you can do that legallY, but you' d have to specify--that-you are
assigning those development rights ,under a. park trust .. Then it ' s
farily inviolate... As far as zoning is concerned, in my judgement,
and I 've now been a witness in two state supreme court cases and
in federal court supporting the Town of Brookhaven and the Town
APRIL 22, 1980 85,
of. East Hampton on the"i:r two acme zori rig: Two- acre zoning. In
urban areas and suburban areas it is the maximum that has been
sustained in the State of New York and you have to have special
cases and I would agree with you, I believe a special case could
be made for two acre zonign. Two acre zoning would then mean that
if these 28 .par.cels were to be subdivided at some point in the
future, then the Ultimate would not be 280 houes but 140 houses.
Thatwould be then the ultimate choice .
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : - So often I 've heard that we hand. king of
exclusionary zoning here in the Town of Southold of one acre and
indeed with our water situation being what it is; it ' s not unheard
of, in the last three years I 've heard two acres and certainly that
could be considered exclusionary when there isn' t any other avenues .
What I 'm saying is, the justification for this type of zoning --- you
have to hang your hat somewhere, and where we 've been hanging our
hat is on our aquifier and -I would presume on an island such as
Robins Island that you'd be able- to - hang your hat on some kind of
water situation as a justification for that special type zoning.
DR. KOPPELMAN: You could justify that , as I said, and this has been
handed . down by Jude McInnery, Federal Judge Pratt , that under these
conditions two acre zoning can be be upheld and made it' damn clear they
wouldn ' t - go beyond two acres: The state supreme court case has been
challenged on appeal and -I have been informally notified by the
appellate division that they ' re a little nervous about two acre
zoning and that they would hope we could put our own house ' in order
to avoid the situation. So we have to go .to. the court of appeals
on this one. ..
COUNCILMAN -NICKLES : I understand exactly, and I think everything
you say is valid, but this a unique circumstance and I think if
you went to court on such a case where these people, number one,
voluntarily have subscribed -to these size lots and then if we further
reinforce what they have- voluntarily offered to us, I don 't know where
their case in court would be, especially in light of the water
conditions there as people lead me to believe they are somewhat
marginal and would only support 28 lots .
DR. KOPPELMAN: The- position that citizens on Fire Island
have. On Fire Island most of the aquifer; due to saltwater intrusion
and the brackish nature of overwash, is partially saline. So' the
people on Fire Island have to bring Iin water, in some cases; in
these plastic containers.
COUNCILMAN NICKLES: We 're bringing in water now..
DR. KOPPELMAN: You Piave to in the future .
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : Robins Island has the only water without Temik
out here.
DR. KOPPELMAN: You may have to bring in water from Brookhaven. If
you bring in water you lose the zoning case entirely because the
court will say, just as they have when people have said, let us have
four acre zoning because we don ' t have parking for` cars,- and the
courts invariably have said, it ' s a governmental responsibility to
handle transportation. If you let the people in, then provide the
services . You' d have the same situation on the -.water . I 'm saying
to you, that if you ask me to go to court as an expert witness for
the Town I could go in clear conscience to support two acre zoning
and I 'd be happy to do so. But I would hot in clear conscience,
knowing the case law and knowing the facts , argue to support something
in increase of that .
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : You could support 62 acre lots and 9 acres on
Robins Island rather than one acre lots?
DR. KOPPELMAN: Oh, well, philosophically, yes, but in terms of the
jurisprudence of it , no . You wouldn 't win the case .
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : I have another thought , but I don't have any
more questions . I thank Dr. Koppelman for his.- time and he has a
great background of knowledge and this is a subject 'I know is very
dear to hi.s heart because I 've know Dr . Koppelman, perhaps for
APRIL 22, 1980
17 years and. if there is anybody that cares about Robins Island, I
think Dr. Koppelman does. He cares about it as much as any man on
this Town Board or any man. -in this room, or woman. My wife says .
I am chauvinistic, it comes out under pressure. I 'm .glad you're
still here, Lee, because I was going , to read a letter from Mr.
William W. Esseks who is the. counsel for the Southold Development
group. "Dear Mr . Esseks : " This is a letter from the New York State
Department of Environmental Conservation. . "Dear Mr . Esseks : I am ' .
responding to your letter of January 4, pertaining to Robins Iland..
Your letter is reassuring. As a consequence, I am willing to make
the following statements for the New York State Department of Environ-
mental Conservation. We find your proposal to file a subdivision
with less than 36 lots upon the whole island a reasonable one, providin
that the following conditions are met : a) That the people of the State
of New York, as adjacent and enfolding landowners to Robins Island, 91
be provided covenants from the Southold Development Corporation
ensuring the restrictions to subdivision ,will be permanent and
bidning to all heirs and assigns, and b) That there be a protective
covenant applicable to the upland wetland area on the northerly side
of the island, with an appropriate buffering upland border . I. believe
that if the above conditions are met , there would be no need for the
State to acquire, any part of Robins Island in order to preserve the
public. interest in fish adn .wildlife values, not only on the island,
but also ,in the adjoining marine waters . " - That is from A.S. Taormina,
Director of Marine Resources . I would only make one other comment
in closing, I heard it said here -that Fishers Island, costs the Town-
money. I 've only been on the Town Board .a- short time since July, but
I have a definite impression that Fishers Island send more money
over here to the mainland than we send back in services. They have
their own fire district , they have their own ferry district, fhey ...._..-
have their own sewer, they have their own, se.hool district . The only
thing .that we pay for over there to really any degree is their highway
system. Thank you.
COUNCILMAN DRUM: I'm going to address myself directly to the
resolution before me and I would like to say I cannot support this
resolution in its present form. I do not feel that it -- we talk
about a fragile ,land. I think our economy today is most fragile,
especially out .here in Southold Town. We are close to• zero growth
in Southold Town today . and our economy, I am concerned about it, I
am concerned about the tax. Unfortunately, Dr . Koppelman left . (Dr.
Koppelman was. still at the meeting. ) He. mentioned where our county
tax has now gone to $711, 000, 000. the county budget . To purchase
Robins Island is going to cost I don 't know .how many million, several
million. Now, this is part of the whereas, where it states in this
resolution it would .be of great economic benefit to the Town. I
find this difficult in this resolution. . It further states in the
resolution that there would be ranger control . Now, rnager
control, if you are going to protect an island that is going to ,be
owned by a government agency,, you must_ have someone on it . You and
I all know how we feel about government property. We can go on it .
So , now we 're talking about 4 -5 families living on Robins Island.
Rangers . This costs us money. They must get back and Jorth. We
talked about the 100 people. Now, here is our Supervsior saying
100. and we would control it . When this resolution goes before the
county legislature what is their opinion going to be? Their opinion
is going to be : Southold Town Board is in favor of acquisiton of Robins
Island. Do -you think we are going to be able to limit the number?
Look at what we are faced with today with our .legislature as far as
prov.iding. us with our .maintenance costs and what not . This is my
concern and these are my reasons. I , at present , sas I say, in its
present form, I cannot support this resolution. I do not feel , as
a member of your Town Board,, that I would be- displaying fiscal
responsibility -and several years ago before I was elected one, Mr .
Carl Vail said, "You ' ll only get my vote if you are responsible when
you take the job. " I don ' t know whether I got his vote or not , but
I am concerned about our economy . and . I think it is most fragile today.
At present your Plannign Board has the proposal, the owner ' s proposal
before it . Now, the owner did offer these development rights . But
this is before your Planning Board. Remember we 've all been here
since -- the Town since 1640," long before western Suffolk Counties
were established, before the state was formed. But I-only say this,
we do have this before us . I do. not feel there is any great urgency
tonight to approve this resolution.
SUPERVISOR PELL: Before I ask the Clerk to poll the Board, which I
will do next , we have Assistant County Attorney here, I just had a
note handed to me, I don ' t even know your name.
APRIL 22, 1980 87,
PATRICIA DEMPSEY: , Assistant County,-,At.tprney:,- . .I am here on behalf
of the county and the county executive: It is the county ' s position
that they are in full support of this resolution adn they will
cooperate with the Town in working out and effectuate a program
of acquisition and practical management of Robins Island so that
it is preserved in its natural state.
1. The following is the vote of the Southold Town Board on the motion:..
made by Supervisor Pell, seconded by Councilman Nickles which reads
as follows :
WHEREAS, Robins Island, . a 400+ acre natural Island in the Town of
Southold, is a unique natural area, and
WHEREAS, it has been recommended for preservation by the Suffolk
County Planning .Commission ' since 1960, ane
WHEREAS, several recent proposals have discussed the public
acquisition of RobinsIsland, and
HWEREAS, this Island is of prime concern to the Government and people
of the Town,- of Southold, and
WHEREAS, the proper idspositi.on, management , and use of this Island
could be of great economic and environmental benefit to the Town of
Southold, Now Be It Therefore
RESOLVED, that the Town Board of Southold wishes to go on record, by
adopting this home rule resolution, that it is in favor of the
protection and preservation of this important .peice of Southold
real estate, abd Be It Further
RESOLVED that the Town Board of the Town of Southold wishes to inform
the County Executive, the Legislature, and Legislator Blass, of the
Town' s . support for- the .County acquisition of Robins Island, if it is
to be in accord with the following:
1. That the Island be acquired by the County of Suffolk under
the provisions of the Nature Trust of the Suffolk County
Charter to insure that the Island will remain a preservation
area in perpetuity and not at any time developed for intensive
park purposes .
2 . That the County assign adequate ranger control to insure the
safe monitoring of the Island, and that the ranger control be
under the Town jurisdiction,.:
3 . - hat the management policies be assigned to the Town of
Southold so that the effective control of the Island be at
the Town level in order to protect the interests of the
. people of _the .Town -- a policy that already' is in existence
whereby County park properties such as the County holdings
at Shinnecock in the Town of Southampton, are -managed -by the
municipality rather than the County. .
4. That the County phase out the tax burden to the New Suffolk
school' .district and the ,Town of Southold°by including within
the acquisition a twenty year tax phase out program that
would .reduc,e the- contribution to .the district and Town by
five percent each year during the twenty year period.
Vote of the Town Board:, No, Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum. Aye: Supervsior Pell .
This resolution was defeated.
2 . On motion of Councilman Nickles; seconded by Councilman Murdock, it was
RESOLVED that the Town Board of the Town of Southold accept, with
regret , the resignation of Darline Salmon as part-time Dog Warden
effective April 16, 1980.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes': Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly. adopted.
COUNCILMAN NICKLES : We give ,the thanks of the Board to Darline
Salmon because she came on the scene when. we were short handed. It
was a job well don . e
3 . SUPERVISOR PELL: Number. 3 , as I said before, there was an imprint
in the bill . (Senate Bill 4771-A entitled "AN ACT to erect the
county of Peconic from the territory now comprised of the towns of
East Hampton, Riverhead, Shelter Island, Southampton. and Southold,
in the County of 'Suffolk. ")
4 . On motion of Councilman Drum, 'seconded by Councilman Murdock, it was
RESOLVED that the Southold Town Board declares itself lead agency
in regard to the State Environmental-- Quality Review Act in the matter
of the application, .of George W. Bornshcein for a. wetland permit on
APRIL 22, 1980
certain property located on the east side of Oak Street, on Eugene' s
(East ) Creek-, Cutchogue, New York.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
5 . Moved by Councilman Murdock, seconded by Councilman Drum,
WHEREAS, Sacred Heart R.C. Church, Cutchogue, New York has applied
to the Town Clerk for a Bingo License, and
WHEREAS, the Town Board has examined the application and after
investigation, duly made findings and determinations as required
by law,
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED that the Supervisor be and he hereby
is authorized and directed to execute on behalf of the Town Board of
the Town of Southold the findings and determinations as required by
law, and it is further
RESOLVED that the Town Clerk be and she hereby is directed to issue
a Bingo License to Sacred Heart R.C. Church, Cutchogue, New York.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles , Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
6 . On motion of Councilman Sullivan, seconded by Councilman Murdock, it was
RESOLVED that pursuant to Article 8 of the Environmental Conservation
Law State Environmental Quality Review and 6NYCRR PaRT 617, Section
617 . 10 and Chapter 44 of the Code- of the Town of Southold, notice is
hereby given that the Southold Town Board, as lead agency for the
action described below, has determined that the -project will not have
a significant effect on the environment .
DESCRIPTION OF ACTION
Application of En-consultants, Inc. for William Thompson for a wetland
permit . Permission is requested to construct a timber dock, catwalk,
ramp and float at Canoe Path on Mattituck Creek, Mattituck, New York.
The project has been determined not to have a significant effect on the
environment for the following reason:
An environmental assessment has been submitted which indicated
that no significant adverse effect to be environment are likely to
occur should the project be implemented as planned.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilmen-.�,..;.
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
7. On motion of Supervisor Pell, seconded by Councilman 'Drum, it was
RESOLVED that the Town Board of the Town of Southold-accept the bid
of Tryac Truck &Equipment Co . , Inc. for supplying the Southold Town
Highway Department with one 1981 International Model 2554 Dump Truck
at $35,469. 00, and authorizing Highway Superintendent Dean to enter
into a contract with Tryac Truck & Equipment Co . , Inc. for the
purchase of said truck.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Mur,odck, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
8. Moved by Councilman Drum, seconded by Councilman Murdock,
. WHEREAS, Robert W. Gillispie, Jr . , a most valued member of the
Southold Town Board of Appeals retired from public service on
June 30, 1979, and
WHEREAS, Robert W. Gilliepie, Jr . has given generously of his
time and talents in his faithful service to the Town of Southold
residents as a member of the Southold Town Planning Board from
May 1, 1955 through April l9, 1957 ..and Chairman and...Member of the
Southold Town Board of Appeals from April 19, 1957 through June
30, 1979, and
WHEREAS, his record of fine service to the Town of Southold and
its people deserves the sincere gratitude of those with whom and
for whom he worked, and
WHEREAS, the Town of Southold will be deprived of his wise counsel
and judgement as a member of the Southold Town Board of .Appeals, now
therefore be it
RESOLVED that the Town of Southold hereby expresses their most
sincere appreciation to Robert W. Gilliepie, Jr . , for his unselfish
and wholehearted cooperation and untiring efforts on behalf of the
Town and accept with sincere regret his decision to retire, and
extend their best wishes for the years ahead, and be ,it further
RESOLVED that a copy of this resolution be forwarded to Mr. Gillispie
and entered in the permanent record of this Town Board meeting.
APRIL 22, 1980 8 9
Vote of, the Town Board: Ayes: Councilman Sullivan, , Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, . Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was - declared duly adopted..
9. Moved by Councilman Nickles., seconded by Councilman Murdock,
WHEREAS, the Southold Town Planning Board wishes to amend the Rules
and Regulations for the Subdivision of Land, and
WHEREAS, the Southold Town Planning Board held a public hearing in
reagrd to said amendments .of the Rules and Regulations of the Sub-
division of Land on April 7, 1980, now, therefore, be it
RESOLVEDthat the Town. Board of the Town of Southold approves the
following amendments to Chapter . 106 of the Code of the Town. of
Southold , Subdivision of Land, as follows :
1 . By amending Article II , Section A106-22, Subdivision A
(2) of said Regulations to read as follows :
(2) All applications-for plat approval for minor
subdivisions shall be accompanied by a fee of ffity ($50. 00)
dollars, or .twenty-five ($25. 00) dollars, per lot .whichever
is greater .
II . By amending Article II , Section A106-25 of said Regulations
by adding a new subdivision thereto to be subdivision F to read
as follows :
_ . F. Safeguards during construction. In order to
prevent flooding,' erosion or any other dangerous or
hazardous condition from occuring during the progress
and completion of , required improvements, the Planning
Board may require the developer, or his contractor,, to
take such action, including the construction and/or
installation of temporary facilities, as the construction
inspector may recommend.
III . By amending Article III , Section A106-23, Subdivision B of
said Regulations to read as follows :
B. Improvements . Streets . shall be graded and
improved with pavements, curbs and gutters, sidewalks,
drainage facilities, water mains, sewers, streetlights
and street signs, street trees and fire hydrants and/or
firewells . Firewells shall have an eight inch casing
and a twenty foot stainless steel screen and shall have
a pumping capacity of three hundred didty (350) gallons
per minute . There shall be a depth of water at least
forty (40) feet . The number and location of the fire hydrants
and/or firewells shall be determined by the Planning Board.
In making such determination, the Planning Board may seek
the recommendation of the Commissioners of the Fire District
in which the proposed subdivision is located. Notwith-
standing the foregoing, upon request , the Planning Board,
upon written approval of the Superintendent of Highways
and the Town Board Highway Committee , may waive subject to
appropriate conditions, such improvements as it considers
may be omitted with jeopardy to the public health, safety
and general welfare: Pedestrian easements shall' be imporved
as required by the Planning Board. Such grading and improve-
ments shall be approved as to design and specifications by
the Town Superintendent of Highways and the Town Board Highway
Committee .
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution .was declared duly adopted.
10. On motion .of Supervsior Pell, .seconded by Councilman Drum, it was
RESOLVED that the Town Board of the Town of Southold approves the
bond estimate. for i-improvements in Long Pond Estates, Section I as
presented by Lawrence M. Tuthill, TownEngineer, in the amount of
$380, 000 . 00
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
11. On motion of Councilman Murdock, seconded by Councilman Drum, it was
RESOLVED that the Town of Southold engage the services of Max Tejo
as a part time (not more than 20 hours per week) Dog Warden at a
salary of $4.75 per hour effective immediately.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
12 . On motion of Councilman Drum, seconded by Councilman Murdock, it was
RESOLVED that the Town Board of the Town of Southold reappoint Terry
9'a APRIL 22, 1980
R. Tuthill a member of the Southold Town. Board o.f Appeals effective
April 19, 1980 through April 19, 1985 .
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
13 . On motion of Councilman Nickles, seconded by Councilman Sullivan, it was
RESOLVED that the Town Board of the Town of Southold reappoint
Frederick E. Gordon a member of the Southold Town Planning Board
effective April 30, 1980 through April 30., 1985 .
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles , Councilman Drum,, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
14 . On motion of Councilman. Sullivan, seconded by Councilman Murdock.,_itwas
RESOLVED that the Town Board of the Town of Southold support Senate
Bil1. 2153 and Assembly Bill 2822 entitled "AN ACT to amend the
environmental conservation law, in relation to litter and solid ,
waste control" , and be it further
RESOLVED that the Town Clerk be and she hereby is directed to
complete the necessary forms and submit them to the New York State
Senate and New York State Assembly,
Vote of the Town Board-:Ayes.: Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
MRS . JEAN TIDEKE : Mr. Supervisor , I stayed long enough so I could
commend the Board on ' passing that resolution pertaining to the
bottle and litter-bill . I-:think it will be a great advantage
to the town, county, and the state.
15 . On motion of Councioman Murdock, seconded by Councilman Drum, it was
RESOLVED that the Town Board of the ' Town of Southold approves the
payment of $14 , 599.40 to Hitchcock Gas Engine Co . , Bridgeport,
Connecticut for items of repair for drydocking the M/V Oldina
above the contract price previously authorized by the Southold
Town Board.
Vote of the Town Board: . Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles , Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
16 . On 'motion of Supervisor Pell , seconded. by Councilman Nickles, it .was
RESOLVED that the Town Clerk be and she hereby is authorized and
directed to advertise for bids for the purchase and application of
150, 000 gallons of asphalt road materials, more or less as may be
needed, delivered and applied, for the use in the repair and maint-
enance of Town Highways.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes,: Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
17 . ' On 'motion of Councilman Nickles seconded by Councilman Murdock, it was
RESOLVED that the ' Town Board of the Town of Southold will hold a
public hearing at the Southold Town Hall, Main Road, Southold, New
York on the 20th , day of May. , 1980, , at 3 :45 P.M. o ' clock' P .M. , at which
time and place all interested persons will be given an opportunity
to be heard upon the following matter : "A Local Law to Provide.
for :the Removal or Repair of Unsafe .Buildings and Collapsed
Structures" which reads as follows :
BE IT ENACTED ' by , the Town Board of the Town of Southold' as
follows -
The -code of the Town of Southold is hereby amended by adding
a new' Chapter thereto, to be Chapter 90, to read as follows :
Sec. 90-1 Title. This chapter shall be known as the "Unsafe Buildings
and Collapsed Structures Law of the Town of 'Southold . "
Sec . 90-2 Purpose. The purpose of this chapter is to promote the
public health, safety and general welfare of the residents of the
Town of Southold and the conservation of property and property values
and to eliminate safety and health hazards .
Sec. 90-3 Unsafe buildings prohibited. All buiddings or structures
which are structurally unsafe, ;dangerous, unsanitary or not provided
with adeauate egress or which in relation to existing use constitute
a hazard to safeyt or health by reason of inadequate maintenance, !
dilapidation, obsolescence or abandonment are, severally, for the
purpose of this chapter, unsafe buildings. All such buildings and
structures are hereby declared to be illegal and are prohibited and
APRIL 22, 1980
shall be abated by the repair and rehabilitation ;or by 'demolition .
andremoval in accordance with -the procedures of this chapter .
Sec . 90-4 Inspection and report . When in the opinion of the Building
Inspector, any structure located in the town shall be deemed to be
unsafe or dangerous to the public, he shall make a formal inspection
thereof and thereafter prepare a written report thereof and file the
same in his office .
ec. 90-5. Service of Notice. A. When it shall be determined by the
Building Inspector that a building or structure is dangerous or unsafe
to the public, he shall promptly serve or cause to be served a notice
on the owner or other persons having an interest in such property or
structure as hereinafter provided . B. The aforementioned notice shall
be served on the owner of the premises or some one of the owner 's
executors, legal representatives, agents, lessees or other person having
a vested or contingent interest in same as shown by the last completed
assessment roll of the town, either personally or by
certified mail , addressed to the person intended to be served at the
last known place of residence or business. If the notice is served
at the last known place of residence or business. If the notice is
served by certified mail, the Building Inspector shall cause a copy
of such notice to be posted on the premises .
Sec. 90-6 . Contents of notice . Thenotice referred to in Sec. 90-5 hereof
shall contain the following: A. A description of the premises .
B. A statement of the particulars in which the building or structure
is unsafe or dangerous . C. An order requiring the building or structure
to be made safe and secure, repaired, demolished or removed.
D. A statement that the securing, repair, demolition or removal of the
building or structure shall commence within ten (10) days from the
date of the service of the notice and shall be completed within thirty.
(30) days thereafter . The Building . Inspector may extend the time of
complaince specified in the notice where there is evidence of intent to
comply within the time specified and conditions exist which prevent
immediate complaince . In granting any such extension of time, the
Buidling Inspector may impose such conditions ashe maydeem appropriate.
E. A statement that in the event of the neglect or refusal of the
person served with notice to comply with same, a survey of the premises
will be made by an inspector and architect appointed by the person so
notified, and in the event of the refusal or neglect of the person so
notified to appoint a surveyor, the two (2) surveyors named by the
TownBoard shall make the survey and report .
F. A statement that in the event the building or structure shall be
reported unsafe or dangerous under such survey, an application will be
made at a special term of the Supreme Court , Tenth Judicial District , for
an order determining the building or structure to be a public nuisance
and directing that it shall be repaired and secured or taken down and
removed.
G. A statement that in the event the building or structure shall be
reported unsafe or dangerous under such survey and in the event of the
neglect or refusal of the person served with notice to repair and secure
or take down such building or structure , the land on which the building
or other structure is located shall be assessed for all costs and
expenses incurred by the Town in connection with the proceedings to
repair and secure or take down and remove, including the cost of
actually removing said building or ' structure .
Sec. 90-7 Posting of report of survey. Tn the event of the neglect or
refusal of the person service with notice to appo.ilnt a surveyor, as
provided in Sec. 90-6E hereof, the Building Inspector shall cause a
signed copy of the report of the survey made - for the town to be posted on
the building or structure and shall provide for compensation or surveyors
in making their survey and in preparing the report- thereof .
Sec . 90-8 Emergency" measures to' vacate. I -f the Building Inspector
determines in his inspection of any building or structure that there is
actual and immediate danger of failure or collapse so as to endanger life,
he shall promptly require the building, structure or portion thereof to
be vacated forthwith and not - to be reoccupied until- the specified
repairs are completed, inspected and approv. ed ,by the Building Inspector
For this purpose he may enter such building or structure or land on
which. it stands :br adjoining land or structures with such assistance
and at .such cost as may be necessary . He may also order adjacent
structures to be vacated and protect the public by appropriate
barricades or such other. means as may be necessary. He may also
order adjacent structures to be vacated and protect the public by:
appropriate barricades or such:,other means as- may be necessary and
for this purpose may close a private or public right-way-of . - The
Building Inspector shall cause to be posted at each entrance to such
building or structure a notice stating, "This building is unsafe and
92 APRIL 22, 1980
its use or occupancy has been prohobited by the Building Inspector. "
Such notice shall remain posted until the required repairs are made or
demolition is completed. It shall .be unlawful .for any person, form
or corporation or their,`agents or other persons to remove such notice
without written permission of the .Building Inspector or for any person
to enter the .building except for tha purpose of making the required
repairs or the demolition there of .
Sec. 90-9 Costs and expenses . All costs and expenses incurred by the
Town of Southold in connection with .any proceeding. or any work done
to remove the danger, or in connection with the demolition and
of any such building or structure shall be assessed against the land
on which such building or structure is located, and a statement of
such expenses shall be presented to the owner of the property, or if
the owner cannot be ascertained or, located, then such statement shall
be posted in a conspicious place on the premises. Such assessment
shall be and constitute a lien upon. such land. If the owner shall fail
to pay such expenses within ten days after the statement ,.is presented
or posted, a legal action may be brought to collect such assessment .or
to foreclose such lien . As an alternative to the maintenance of any
such action, the Building Inspector may file a certificate of the
actual expenses incurred as . aforesaid, together with a statement
identifying the property in connection with which the expenses were
incurred, and the owner thereof , with the assessors, who shall in the
preparation of the next assessment roll., assess such amount upon such '
property. Such amount shall be. included, in the levy against such
property, shall constitute a lien and shall be- collected -.and enforced
in the same nammer, by the same proceedings, at the same time, and
under the same penalties as is provided- by law for the collection
and enforcement of real property taxes in the Town ofSouthold.
Sec,. 90-10 Penalties for Offerises . . A. Any person who neglects,
refuses or fails to comply with any order or notice issued. hereunder
shall be guilty of an offense. punishable by a fine not. to. exceed two
hundred fifty dollars ($250 . ) , .or by imprisonment for a, term not to
exceed fifteen (15) days, . or both such fine and imprisonment.. Each.
week ' s continued violation shall constitute a seperate additional
offense or violation. B. Nothing in this chapter shall .be construed
as depriving the town :of any. other available .remedy relevant, to a.
violation of this chapter .
Sec. 90-11 Seve'rability. The invalidity of any section,, subsection or
provision of this chapter shall no invalidate any other section, sub=
section or provision thereof .
Sec. 90=12 .When effective. This chapter shall take effect immediately.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, - Councilman
Murdock:, Councilman Nickles, Councilman' Drum, Supervisor -.Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted. .
SUPERVISOR PELL: The hearing is. May 20th .at 3 :45 P.M. If you
want a copy of it come to the Town Clerk.,_ It is a three page
document .
18 . Moved by Supervisor Pell , -seconded by Councilman Drum.
WHEREAS, Burton Potter Post #185, American Legion, Greenport, New
York has applied to the Town Clerk for a Bingo License, and
WHEREAS, the Town Board has examined the .application and after
investigation, duly made findi;ngs .and determinations as required.
by law,
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED that. the Supervisor be and he hereby.
is authorized and. directed to execute on behalf' of the Town Board
of the Town of Southold the findings and determinations as .required
by law, and it is further
RESOLVED that the Town Clerk , be and she hereby is directed to issue
a Bingo License to the Burton Potter Post #185, American Legion,
Greenport , New York.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman, Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
19 . On motion of Councilman Drum, seconded. by Superviso.r. Pell, .it ,cwas
RESOLVED that the Chief of Police be and he hereby,; is, ,authorized
and directed to: purchase a Horizon VHF radio for the Mako used .
by the Bay Constable, at a price not to exceed $650. 00; said price
to include radio , mount , installation and theft proof rack.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum,_ Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
APRIL 22, 1980 9a
20 . Moved by Councilman. _Murdock_,,:.lseconded,: , j3.y.,-1C,ouncilman Drum
. WHEREAS, this Town Board desires o amend the Federal Revenue
Sharing Budget of the current Town Budget of the Town of Southold
.by amending the use of Federal Revenue. Sliaring funds as follows :
By transferring and/or reassigning the sum of $11, 500. 00 from the
New Suffolk -Roadt.1'.Improvement- Account (:CF9007.4) to Highway Safety
Improvement Account (CF9007 .4) ,
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED that a .public hearing will be held
by the Town Board of the TOwn of Southold with respect to said
amendment' to said Budget on,-the 20th day of May, 1980, at 3 :40
o ' clock P.M.. at th6,,,Zouthold Town Hall, Main Road, Southold, New
York, at which hearing all citizens of the Town shall be given an
opportunity to provide '-written and oral comments with respect to
said amendment .
Vote of the Town Board--. Ayes: Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles , Councilman Drum, 'Supervisor Pell ..
Thsi resolution was declared duly adopted.
21 . On motion of Councilman Nickles,, seconded by Councilman Murdock, it was
RESOLVED: that . the Town Board of the Town of Southold transfer
$3,466 . 89 from General Fund Whole Town Contingent Account A1990.4
to Other Funds (Recreation Center) A9991 .4 .
COUNCILMAN SULLIVAN: Discussion. Bill, maybe you could explain
that .
SUPERVISOR PELL. What this is for, we have finally got the okay
.today from thearchitect and the clerk of the works Bill -Smith to
pay Strathmore $13, 000. 00, it ' s the next one down, $900. , and some
odd change, in order for us to have enough .money to , pay all of the
construction bills that are 'left . , Instead of transferring so much
today and so much next -month we .are transfe.rring t'his total amount
we need to pay off all the contractors involved in the Senior
Citizen/Youth building onPeconic Avenue. This is the general,
contractor who had all -the 'leaks and problems with the doors and
this stuff. . We aremoving ahead towards taking it over'. It is
this is the big one we had to have done and he finally did Meet
Mr. Smith 's and Sacco and Ahlers satisfaction today, so we are going
to pay him for this so we have to transfer the funds.
Vote of the Twon Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Counc.ilman
,Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell..
This resolution was declared duly addpted.
22. On motion of Councilman Murdock, seconded by Councilman -NIckles, it was
RESOLVED that the bill ofStrathmore Construction Corp. ,in the amount
of $13, 912 . 50 for the remainder of the work completed by them at the
Senior Citizen/Youth Center be and hereby is authorized to be paid.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
23 . Moved-'by Councilman Murdock., seconded by Councilman' Drum,
WHEREAS, the present contract with the Civil Service Employees
Association, Inc. , Suffolk Chapter , Southold Town Unit, the employee
organization representing all employees except members, of the Police
Department terminates onDecember 31, 1980', and
WHEREAS, CSEA by' the terms of said agreement was granted,�unchallenged
representation status until seven months prior to the' expiratibn date
os said agreement , and
WHEREAS, CSEA has requested that it- be recognized as the employee
organization in negotiations for a new agreement commencing January
1, 1980, and
WHEREAS, on the basis of. dues deduction authorizations and other
. evidence, this Board has ascertained that CSEA is the choice of the
employees .
NOW, THEREFORE, IT IS RESOLVED, that the'--Town does hereby recognize
CSEA as the exclusive-:employee organization to represent the members
until' seven months prior to, the expiration of the successor
agreement commencing January 1, 1981, or as otherwise limited
by the provisions of the Civil Service Law.
Vote �of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
94' APRIL 22, 1980
24 . On motion of Supervisor Pell, seconded by Councilman Nickles, it was
RESOLVED that the Town Clerk be and she hereby is authorized and
directed to advertise for bids for repair of approximately 78 ft .
of bulkhead in Mattituck Creek at Mill Road, Mattituck, New York.
Vote of the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan; 'Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles, Councilman Drum, SupervisorPell ,
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
SUPERVISOR PELL: Explaination for tha -is, I saw several eyebrows go
up, the bulkhead between the Old Mill Inn and Anchor Inn is Town
bulkhead there. It has caved in, washed out and right now Mr . Deari
has it roped off so nobody can get hurt and it has to be repaired.
We did not anticipate this when we made up last year 's budget , it
is something the Town Board is going to have to find money for or
go out. to bond or'• something, but it ' s something that' must be fixed
before it caves in and somebody gets hurt and we go more problems
on our hands.
25 . Moved by Councilman Drum, seconded by Councilman Sullivan,
WHEREAS, Lefferts P. Edson has made application to the Town Board
of the Town of Southold to dedicate certain roads in Cutchogie,
New York, to be known as CROWN LAND LANE and SPUR ROAD, as shown
on a certain map entitled, '.'Map of Crown Land Lane" ;" Town of Southold,
Suffolk County, New York, surveyed March 12, 1975 by Roderick Can
Tuyl, P.C. , Licensed Land Surveyors and filed in the Suffolk County
Clerk' s Office on August 17, 1975 as Map No. 6289, together with
release executed by the owner thereof, and
WHEREAS, the Southold Town Highway Superintendent and Southold Town
Board -Highway Committee has inspected the said highways and has
advised the Town Board that sid proposed highways comply in all
respects with the specifications for the dedication of highways in
the Town of Southold,
NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED that in accordance. with ,Section 171
of the Highway -Law of -the State of New York, consent be and the same
is given- to the Superintendent of Highways to make an order laying
out the aforesaid highway, to consist of lands described in said
application as shown on certain maps attached to said application, an
BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED,.that the Town Clerk be and she hereby is
authorized and directed to forwith cause the dedication, release
and deed to be recorded in the office of the Clerk of the County of
Suffolk, New York.
Vote of the Town Board : Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murdock, Councilman Nickles , Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted..
SUPERVISOR PELL: Does any Councilman have anything he wishes to bring
. up at this time? (no reponse)
MIKE CORTESE; Mattituck: asked what progress has been made on the law
for citizens committees?
SUPERVISOR PELL: We had a hearing this afternoon. We had three
people here, two spoke for and one spoke opposed to it, different
points- of it . Now, we will get the transcripts of the hearing and
probably rule on it at the next Town Board meeting. Yes, we did
have people here .---Anyone else wish to be heard? (No response. )
If not , I am going to thank you for coming out and I can honestly
say I 'm glad the night is over . Thank you all . Motion to adjourn?
On motion of Councilman Murdock, seconded by Councilman Sullivan, it was
RESOLVED That therei be i rig.,no further, bus.iness-.to..come 'b.efo.re'::th'7's
Town Board meeting adjournment be called at 10: 30 P.M. P.M.
Vote fo the Town Board: Ayes : Councilman Sullivan, Councilman
Murodck, Councilman ,Nickles, Councilman Drum, Supervisor Pell .
This resolution was declared duly adopted.
A
Judith T. Terry
Town Clerk